Is Fornication Really A Sin? - Religion (2) - Nairaland
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| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by syrup(f): 9:48am On May 28, 2008 |
Jagoon: @Jagoon, Hahaha!! Okay, I'm sorry you thought I meant you directly in using the term "you" - I earlier said it was used as a "generic" modifier (which means, anyone not in particular). All the same, I am still waiting to see another chapter that embraces (and allows) your own definition!  - - - - Besides, keep those zippers up until you find that chapter!  |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by kolopin(f): 12:28pm On May 28, 2008 |
you did not post this as a Question you honestly needed an answer to. your mind is made up and you are just looking for pple that share your view or wld rub your back, im glad you are yet to get those. whatever you decide to do with your knowledge, and mis interpretation of the bible is strictly up to you but ill warn you of one thing though BE CAREFUL. dont mislead a feeble mind that is reading what u ve to say. the bible says it will be better for a stone to be tried round your neck and be thrown in the middle of the ocean than for you to cause this little ones to sin. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by kolaoloye(m): 12:37pm On May 28, 2008 |
Fornication is not just a sin but a Virus. If you are living as a fornicator, then be rest assured that your days are numbered. It is a bitter truth. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Nobody: 1:06pm On May 28, 2008 |
kola oloye:Prophet of doom  , kindly quote the passage in there bible which says that fornication is a virus or that your days are numbered if you fornicate. One thing i can't stick is hypocritical self righteous people. Even the woman who commited adultery in the bible and was to be stoned was forgiven by Jesus, he saved her from being killed. He that is without sin (like Kola oloye) should cast the frist stone. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by okenwa(m): 2:23pm On May 28, 2008 |
@ poster it takes humanity thousands of years to develope a language. . . interpreting it in another language/tongue is another issue entirely. that you saw conflicts in the interpretation of FORNICATION in the Bible, does not mean it is not a sin. the ACT is what the writer was trying to discribe as SEXUAL IMMORALITY. (which can be premarital sex, homosexual, or whatever.) 1 Like |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by kolaoloye(m): 4:15pm On May 28, 2008 |
Jagoon: There is a big difference between falling into sin under temptation and living in sin.They are not the same thing at all. Paul said 'Shall we continue in sin that the grace may abound? God forbid'. Besides am not claiming to be holy,i was only answering a simple question. Afterall the bible says in[b] 1 john 1[/b] 8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. Don't also forget where the bible says that such thing (fornication) should not even be mentioned among us. Fornication is bad, it is a sin commited with the temple of God. Fornicators have no place in the Kingdom. Bro,if my earlier response had touched you, please clean up and adjust .The Lord is our strenght. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by kolaoloye(m): 5:18pm On May 28, 2008 |
Bible speaks against fornication[/b]1 Thessalonians 4 1 Furthermore then we beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by the Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more. 2 For ye know what commandments we gave you by the Lord Jesus. [b] 3 For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication: 4 That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour; 5 Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God: colossians3 5[b] Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry: [/b] 6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience Galatians 5 19Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. These are just few. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Nobody: 5:37pm On May 28, 2008 |
@kola oloye This topic as already been thrashed out, if you bothered to read the intial post very well which queried the use and interpretation of fornication instead of the term sexual immorality which was defined clearly in leviticus 18, you would know that it is the interprtation/translation of the scriptures in your last post that is being questioned in this thread, in short your last post is just restating questions that this thread seeks answers for. As i said it has already been thrashed out, and the answer lies in deuteronomy 22 which forbids premarital sex and not all the scriptures you just quoted which is what is being subject to debate because the terminology used (fornication as opposed to sexual immorality) Kola you should endeavour to understand a thread very well before posting your comments  |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Nobody: 11:33pm On May 28, 2008 |
dont look for a safe landing.its a sin. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by reindeer: 11:33pm On Jun 02, 2008 |
Sin ke? no way! Its just a sport, that leads people to hell! |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by joomiegal(f): 10:42am On Jun 04, 2008 |
@ syrup girl more power 2 you. e be lyk say u really hav power in ur fingers to keep typing to this jagoon person. @jagoon i gat just one verse 4 you, wen u stop trying 2 justify (or Pacify) ur screaming conscience, you mite wanna read it. its Rev 22: 11, n lemme quote it 2 u anyways: "He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteaous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. V 12: "And behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with Me, 2 give evry man according as his work shall be". To chikena!! 1 Like |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Frizy(m): 11:25am On Jun 04, 2008 |
Yea, and according to All'ah, it is regarded as a "great sin". |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by reindeer: 11:28pm On Jun 04, 2008 |
oh la la la la la im so so happy! For once we have frizy and the other christian folks on the same side of the coin, this goes to state what i have always believed in, that HIV/AIDS can be best tackled using religion as the most important tool. So guys preach the morality message wherever you are CHurches mosques etc. And to jagooon, millions of self deceiving interpretations cant make wrong right, the earlier you live with the facts as God will have it the better for your soul, at least both christians and moslems cant be wrong at the same time, kapische?  |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Frizy(m): 9:46am On Jun 06, 2008 |
reindeer: Wait now. . I have no reason to justify evil just because a christian says it is. We have a conscience that tells us what good is from bad. I agree with anything the bible says as long as it is so in the Ko'ran. No Mu'slim will say otherwise.  |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by kolaoloye(m): 11:56am On Jun 06, 2008 |
Frizy:This is what i call 'Maturity'. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Spermdrops(m): 1:01pm On Jun 06, 2008 |
You have been phocking all these years and you have not died yet abi? Maybe a few diseases and almost terminal. . .but you still have not died yet. So how can it be a sin? New born babies who have never fornicated die within 30 minutes you know. Go figure! |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by reindeer: 11:44pm On Jun 06, 2008 |
hey friz! really loved your reply.i only wish both religions will dwell more on the things they share and not on their differences, the world will be the better for it believe me, come to think of it all the things shared by the religions are good for humanity, i mean they are morals all aimed at prolonging human life and letting man live in peace, Oh gosh! my heart just aches for humanity the way we have allowed religion to rob us of the blessings of the almighty, and to the man who wants to justify fornication, may the almighty show you the way to true happiness and peace, believe me fornication wont give you true happiness and peace, it only makes you seek more wrongs, perpetuating the vicious cycle our fathers left behind, its time to break away and chart a new course. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Opelope(m): 1:39am On Jun 07, 2008 |
Mr. Lagoon, Fornication is 2 unmarried people having sex while adultery is 2 people married but not to themselves having sexual intercourse with themselves. Now, leviticus 18 answers other questions like an sex between unmarried person and married person as well as homosexuality. That is why neither Fornication nor adultery is mentioned here. It does not in any way support fornication. Is it clear now? |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Nobody: 1:22pm On Jun 10, 2008 |
Opelope:@opelope it is definitely not clear at all. It also does not in anyway even remotely suggest that sex between two unmarried people is wrong. @all thanx for all your responses but at best i ca describe them has very shallow and lacking in substance working to a preconceived answer which lacks biblical backing. I actually tooktime out to explain my lin e of thinking and backed it with scripture, i explained that the term fornication was a wrong translation of sexul immorality by some versions of the bible namely King James version which as been acknowledge not to be an accurate translation of the bible from the original text. What every body as been posting on this thread is the misconception i am trying to resolve. Is there no intellectual on Nairaland that can at least come out with superior bible based facts that establishes that premarital sex is a sin. And please don't quote from King James version which was mis-interpreted. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Opelope(m): 2:36pm On Jun 10, 2008 |
Jagoon: Jagoon, watever the interpretation and use of words, or how intellectual u are, that does not mean u'd understand the bible. Only the Holy Spirit can guide u into the understanding needed. So King James being another translation might me 'misinterpreted' to man but it does not matter wat interpretation it is if the Holy Spirit guides you thru. Sex was made for marriage to build a family and raise up the children in the way of the Lord and sex outside marriage is sexual immorality and therefore a sin. I'm not goin to go about looking for bible passages. If u need quotations and someone to prove it to u, then walk up to ur pastors in church and ask them. Let me know how it goes. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Nobody: 3:29pm On Jun 10, 2008 |
Opelope:@Opelope Well you have just stated your opinion which you are entitled to even though it does not have any biblical justification. You are even insinuating that you understand the bible better than i do even though you cannot refer to the bible to justify your assumptions. For your information i don't don't belong to the school of thought that you need the holy spirit to understand the bible ( the bible was written by men for the benefit of man even though some books were written under inspiration) so it is not subject to spiritual interpretation as some people claim, it is meant for us to read and understand. The difficultly in understanding the bible comes with versions like king james which was written with the Royal court english of those days, this type of english is no longer in use today and a bit difficult to understand. If you want to understand the bible well i suggest you read from the amplified bible, New international version or good news version. This versions are written in plain english easy to understand. Infact the amplified version goes on to explain all key words used in every passage (wether spiritual or not) so that you can have a good understanding of what is being said, so you people should stop this manipulative line that the bible is subject to spiritual interpretation. Also on the suggestion that i should approach a pastor before i can understand what the bible says i laugh at. You see some of us take time to study the bible extensively and at the end of the day i would discover that i know more than the pastor on the topic. Besides pastors are stereotype, they tell you only what they want you to know. I personally have been doing some extensive bible research and my findings are simply amazing. The least i can say is that the church/ pastors are either withholding a lot of truths from us or they don't know the truth themselves. I intend to post a thread on my findings when i conclude this research. One thing is certain though, most christians don't study their bibles extensively neither do they understand it that is why it is so easy for them to be manipulated by religious leaders 1 Like |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Opelope(m): 3:57pm On Jun 10, 2008 |
Ok Lagoon, since you believe Pastors are stereotyped, I would like to refer you to Bro. Gbile Akanni. He is not a Pastor per say but a Bible teacher. He lives in Gboko. Ever heard of him? i will try to get his contact info. for u if u are interested. I believe u know fornication is a sin but i am still not too sure what u are looking for with this Topic. On the other hand, if u choose not to believe pastors or biblical leaders, then I suggest you not only read the bible and assuming u are a true christian, that you go to God in prayer for the answer. Don't know if u'd need to fast but it's only going to serve to help if u did. Btw, i am not suggesting or indicating I know the bible more than u. From all I have read in the bible, i know fornication is a sin against the body and i have not seen anywhere in the bible where it indicates or says it is not a sin so why should i question it or believe otherwise? |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Nobody: 5:02pm On Jun 10, 2008 |
@opelope I have come to the conclusion that most people that responded to this psot don't even understand it, and that is why the responses i have been getting are so poor and not even addressing the fundermental issues of version and interpretation of the kings james version i raised. I don't think i would bother to respond again if the issues i raised are not addressed. if you don't understand go and re -read my initial post again, this time with an open mind, not with a made up mind. emphasis the sexual immorality versus fornication and what the bible says about sexual sins |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by sleekymag(m): 6:04pm On Jun 10, 2008 |
Jagoon, Deut 22:13-30 that you quoted earlier said in verses 23-29 23 If a man happens to meet in a town a virgin pledged to be married and he sleeps with her, 24 you shall take both of them to the gate of that town and stone them to death—the girl because she was in a town and did not scream for help, and the man because he violated another man's wife (note that they[the fiance and her] are not yet married, yet it said another man's wife). You must purge the evil from among you. 25 But if out in the country a man happens to meet a girl pledged to be married and rapes her, only the man who has done this shall die. 26 Do nothing to the girl; she has committed no sin deserving death. This case is like that of someone who attacks and murders his neighbor, 27 for the man found the girl out in the country, and though the betrothed girl screamed, there was no one to rescue her. Does this mean that if a virgin is pledged to be married and disvirginned by her to-be spouse before the marriage, it is not a sin? (as in have sex with her fiance) as it wasn't mentioned amongst the sins (especially since the marriage is hoped to take place anyway, and she is considered his wife already?) Asides from that, Heb 13:4 states that [b]Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge. Again it says the bed is undefiled in marriage, but it doesn't say that engaged couples, or lovers not yet married are defiling the bed by having sex. it mentions adulterers and LovePeddler-mongers (prostitute-patronisers). I also need clarification here, with scriptural backing, and its not that i'm using this to indulge, in fact i'm not indulging in any way. so anybody got answers? (However i know it's best to wait, but most times, its really not easy). |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Nobody: 9:19am On Jun 11, 2008 |
sleekymag:@sleekymag I have re -studied deuteronomy 22 which i quoted earlier and even that doesn't express pre-marital sex is a sin. What was being said was that if a virgin is engaged to someone else and a man rapes her, then the man should be put to death becos the girl is considered as another man's wife.This implies that if it was the man she is engaged to that slept with her, it would be acceptable. Note however in verse 28, : it says If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, 29 he shall pay the girl's father fifty shekels of silver. He must marry the girl, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives. If we look at this in proper perspective, there is no indication that pre-marital sex in itself is a sin. Firstly an extreme case was used here (rape) even when a man rapes a woman that is not engaged he is bound to marry her and the only punish ment is that he would not be allowed to divorce her, how much less if it was mutual consent. If one is to interpret this passage without biase, what is simply being addressed here is the issue of tradition and the premium placed on a woman being a virgin at the time of marriage. In other wards, if a man dis-virgins a woman, he is expected to marry her and pay her dowry so as not to humilate the girls family.The act of the pre-marital sex in itself was not described as a sin. So what was being addressed here can at best be described as socio- cultural issues as was practised at that time. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Nobody: 9:45am On Jun 11, 2008 |
To buttress my point that King James version mis-interpreted the original text of the bible when the word "fornication" was used instead of "sexual immorality" The "New King James Version" which was written to correct the errors in King James version used the word Sexual Immorality and not fornication. This is futher proof that the use of the word fornication in the original King James version was a mis-interpretation. And as i said earlier sexual immorality was dealt with exhaustively in the Levitcus 18 and it clearly ommited pre-marital sex. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by sleekymag(m): 11:42am On Jun 14, 2008 |
However the answer to the question "Is fornication really a sin?" is that YES, fornication is a sin! 1st Corinthians 6:18-20 says it all. 18. Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body. 19. What! know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20. For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's. Also Isaiah 5:20-21 says 20. Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! 21. Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight! Please let's take the bible as it is, and not try to interpret it to soothe our own understanding or desires. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Nobody: 12:16pm On Jun 16, 2008 |
@sleekymag I would assume you failed to read my posts thougroughly, you probably just read the heading of the topic and proceeded to respond. The scripture in the book of 1st cirinthians which you just quoted is from the king James version of the bible which is a wrong translation Most other translations including the "New king James version" (which was written to correct the errors in King James version) use the term "sexual immorality". Immoral sexual practises was thougroughly defined in Leviticus 18 and it did not included pre-marital sex which is commonly refered to as fornication. I know a lot of people would still want to argue this point with me even though they would not be able to substantiate their argument, or fault my position. But i remain convinced until otherwise proven biblically outside the mis-translated King James version that my position is the correct one. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Lady2(f): 8:37pm On Jun 16, 2008 |
Jagoon, lolololol, I see you just want someone to agree with you, sorry no true Bible believer will agree with you. This is why I guidance is needed in studying the Bible. Since you've stated that you have given your life to Christ (I really hope the Spirit is upon you) then by all means consult the Spirit on the matter and see where he leads you. You don't want to take what people have told you, so go and define for yourself, WAIT!! you did, yet you dismiss your own definition. My man, I understand o, bodi no be wood, AIDS is real, HELL is real too. All these are related, can you trace the dots? lololol, this is funny |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by debosky(m): 8:55pm On Jun 16, 2008 |
I have been reading this discussion and its quite interesting; for now I will take an 'unaligned' position for the sake of this topic. I think many of the posters here are failing to see the main point of Jagoons discourse if the word(s) [i]TRANSLATED [/i]as 'fornication' was(were) wrongly translated, then, it means that there is in actual fact nothing like 'fornication' in the bible. It means in essence, that the definitions being given for fornication here - 'sleeping with someone you are not married to', was not the original definition/meaning of the text in its initial form, i.e. the meaning was lost in translation. Now to quote the very translation in question to back up its own authenticity cannot be accepted as a cogent line of reasoning. To the issue of deuteronomy, it doesn't explicitly state that sex with someone you're not 'married to' is wrong or right, but I would like to challenge one of syrup's arguments You said that everyone mentioned in that passage was someone or the others wife, but I disagree - it also talks about sleeping with a woman and her son's daughter, or the woman's daughter as being wrong - not explicitly because they are married or unmarried, but because of having sexual relations with the mother. My main question to Jagoon would be this - what do YOU regard as the sexual sins encompassed under 'sexual immorality'? The second question to all in general is - when exactly is 'marriage' deemed to have occurred in the sight of God? Is it when you both agree to be married and make your pledges to one another (either privately or publicly) or when you sign a legal document, or when you 'solemnize' the union in a church? |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by kolaoloye(m): 8:59am On Jun 17, 2008 |
debosky: As soon as the two of you (man and woman) made a vow to each other with at least two witnesses, then God immediately put it down in the marriage register of heaven.This vow could be done secretly or publicly, (in the church,mosque,shrine,chamber,registry,anywhere at all) the most important thing is the issue of witnesses. |
| Re: Is Fornication Really A Sin? by Nobody: 9:15am On Jun 17, 2008 |
@debosky What i accept as sexual sins are the immoral sexual practices exhaustively listed in Leviticus 18 which i posted at the beginning of this thread. |
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