I may not be a fan of theistic religion(for obvious reasons) but I find that it's almost impossible for humanity to thrive without religion in one form or another.
Why do antireligious people feel the world would be better without religion?!
Tbh I feel it's the corrupted religion(The corrupted version created to manipulate,extort and trap the masses)most people are against and not religion itself.
There are priceless words of wisdom that can be gotten from religious books(e.g. Ecclesiastics) but these words have been shelved by selfish and corrupt leaders of such religion and the words that can be easily manipulated or used for personal gains repeated and repeated.
That being said it would be unwise to assume that the world would be better off without religion when in truth humans seem to be the driving force in the first place.
In conclusion, I believe religion should not be abandoned(Punishment and reward mentality,babaric practices etc probably should with time).Instead,followers of such religion
should be taught to abide by the words of wisdom written in their books cos in the end the real enemies are humans.

Well. I really like the point you gave down.

I think we need to do away with religion because many apologists are of the opinion that religion is what direct our moral compass, and i am here to tell you religion does not.

According to richard dawkins, he said I'd rather have a morality that is reasoned, thought about, discussed, argued, debated, and ultimately designed. Morality is man made, and should be man controlled. We should accept that responsibility and we should not depend on any cosmic sky daddy to determine it for us.

Secondly, if you look at the old testament, the bible was said to have done things based on what was common then. E.g they allowed slavery, they justify rape

hakeem4:
Well. I really like the point you gave down.

I think we need to do away with religion because many apologist are of the opinion that religion is what direct our moral compass, and i am here to tell you religion does not.

According to richard dawkins, he said I'd rather have a morality that is reasoned, thought about, discussed, argued, debated, and ultimately designed. Morality is man made, and should be man controlled. We should accept that responsibility and we should not depend on any cosmic sky daddy to determine it for us.

Secondly, if you look at the old testament, the bible was said to have done things based on what was common then. E.g they allowed slavery, they justify rape

You see that's an error you make cos you feel all humans would be at the same level of understanding and enlightenment about how life should be or what's right and wrong but tbh it's a very big mistake.
That's why I said that religion would be needed for a long time until 90% of humans have attained a level of intelligence that most non theists possess right now. But for now 75% of the human population aren't there yet hence the name "sheeple" but they make up most of the human population and as such can't be ruled out when analyzing how life would be like without religion.I mean look at all the evil in the world right now,do you think religion caused this or did humans find a way to do nefarious things and blame it on religion..."Oh it was the devil that made me rape an 11 year girl" "Why did you stab this woman 67 times? Oh it was the devil"," Why did he open gunfire on the elderly and innocent children in a church? Cos he's a psychopathic athesist"(just tryna prove another point here", "Why did he detonate a homemade bomb at the entrance of a concert that has just ended killing children and women? Cos he's a Muslim who believes those who don't believe in his religion are scum".
You see the pattern here...What's the common factor here,Humans. Would you do the same thing these people did? No.Why? Cos you've attained a level of intelligence where you became your moral compass,they haven't reached there,just as 75% of the population need an external moral compass currently. Some are more morally considerate than others but you get my point. So until those sets of people are wiped out from existence(which I cannot guarantee would happen), there's need for religion.

hakeem4:

Secondly, if you look at the old testament, the bible was said to have done things based on what was common then. E.g they allowed slavery, they justify rape

You see this is one of the issues I have with the bible or Qur'an.. It's has too many irrelevant details that clouds what people should really focus on.The core values that can make people better human beings.

EmperorHarry:

You see this is one of the issues I have with the bible or Qur'an.. It's has too many irrelevant details that clouds what people should really focus on.The core values that can make people better human beings.

But, it is not the holy books that make people do what they do but their (mis)understanding of it. I mean, because God in Deuteronomy is said to command the Israelites to murder and steal peoples' lands, that's no reason to justify Hitlerism, after all, Jesus the Son of God said love those neighbours.

Squaring the circle is what one is presented with often with what you call "irrelevant details", an exercise that develops the mind.

budaatum:

But, it is not the holy books that make people do what they do but their (mis)understanding of it. I mean, because God in Deuteronomy is said to command the Israelites to murder and steal peoples' lands, that's no reason to justify Hitlerism, after all, Jesus the Son of God said love those neighbours.

Squaring the circle is what one is presented with often with what you call "irrelevant details", an exercise that develops the mind.

True.As I stated before,humans are the major problem but at this point it would be conscious ignorance to refute the involment of humans in what was added or removed from this holy books.
The 10 commandments were simple and straight forward.The golden rule was simple and straight foward.It didn't need too many passages to pass the message across.Now we have books like lamentations,Malachi, Micah,Hosea etc.This to me are scriptures that are irrelevant and added to increase the quantity and not the quality of the bible but can be used in the wrong way e.g.The tithe and offering "commandment",seems to be the only time they ever quote that scripture.These are the irrelevant details I'm talking about not because these details aren't questionable or indicative but because these details give people more things to read.Just imagine if,the 10 commandments were the only words in the bible(not necessarily a good thing) but people would focus on these words and it would become a part of them,you get what I'm trying to say here.

EmperorHarry:

Just imagine if,the 10 commandments were the only words in the bible(not necessarily a good thing) but people would focus on these words and it would become a part of them,you get what I'm trying to say here.

Really? The people who could not focus on one simple rule of "don't eat the fruit of this tree" will focus on ten commandments "and it would become a part of them"? When? In 3019? But let me work with you here.

You heard of some guy called Jesus Christ? He went and simplified the entire Bible down to "love each other, and God", very easy exceedingly simple two commandments. How well we doing Emperor with just two commandments? Have these two commandments "become a part of us" yet, we've had them 2000 years?

Yet, fast forward. Imagine 5019. 3000 years from now. The one commandment, the ten commandments, the two commandments, the "lamentations, Malachi, Micah, Hosea etc" commandments and so many more commandments will all become a part of us. You just wish they'd become a part of us already is what. But remember. When we began we didn't know serpents don't talk. Some still think demons do!

I'm going go listen to those books you mentioned to see if you have a point Emperor.

EmperorHarry:

True.As I stated before,humans are the major problem but at this point it would be conscious ignorance to refute the involment of humans in what was added or removed from this holy books.

What do you mean by "added or removed from this holy books"? Do holy books write themselves?

EmperorHarry:
Just imagine if,the 10 commandments were the only words in the bible(not necessarily a good thing) but people would focus on these words and it would become a part of them,you get what I'm trying to say here.

hello there,
Your posts only make sense if you consider that the Bible was written as a moral code for living on earth. Then after death it is heaven or hell.

What if this is not the case. Spiritual books are written mostly to teach people how to "ascend" and to help them in their journey through the various planes of existence and not get lost. The scriptures are then a kind of Maps of the cosmos both the seen and unseen parts, each one describing an area and helping you drove through not getting stuck.

Now if you have never been to calabar, any map describing it will seem insane to you. But if you are familiar with Yaba left, you will find great use in such a map for Yaba.

That's why some spiritual books (in the Bible) seem useless to you. Unknowingly, among the "useless" books you cited there, are some that are so precious that I could not refrain from answering your post.

budaatum:

Really? The people who could not focus on one simple rule of "don't eat the fruit of this tree" will focus on ten commandments "and it would become a part of them"? When? In 3019? But let me work with you here.

I'm not exactly counting on them to adhere to the commandments cos we are humans(we have both good and evil in us) but majority of the population haven't gone berserk and turned the world we live upside down partly because of their moral values and mostly because of the fear(not always) they have due to their religious beliefs that holds them back from doing things without fear of meaningful consequence.The fear of eternal damnation or " sinning against God somehows limits the level of nefarious things a person can do(For people who believe in eternal damnation).I'm not able to fully explain everything,I hope your able to fill in the gaps and get the full picture.

You heard of some guy called Jesus Christ? He went and simplified the entire Bible down to "love each other, and God", very easy exceedingly simple two commandments. How well we doing Emperor with just two commandments? Have these two commandments "become a part of us" yet, we've had them 2000 years?

Yet, fast forward. Imagine 5019. 3000 years from now. The one commandment, the ten commandments, the two commandments, the "lamentations, Malachi, Micah, Hosea etc" commandments and so many more commandments will all become a part of us. You just wish they'd become a part of us already is what.

Your missing my point.I used the ten commandments theory as an example of what I think the bible should have been like with less quantity and more quality.Yes,you have a valid point,we've had these commandments for so long,yet there hasn't been any considerable changes in the world we live in today and in 5019 I doubt there would be any change if there isn't a conscious effort by every human to do good unto others(This is almost impossible and can only happen in an uptopian society which would never exist).

But remember. When we began we didn't know serpents don't talk. Some still think demons do!

I'm going go listen to those books you mentioned to see if you have a point Emperor.

LoJ:
hello there,
Your posts only make sense if you consider that the Bible was written as a moral code for living on earth. Then after death it is heaven or hell.

What if this is not the case. Spiritual books are written mostly to teach people how to "ascend" and to help them in their journey through the various planes of existence and not get lost. The scriptures are then a kind of Maps of the cosmos both the seen and unseen parts, each one describing an area and helping you drove through not getting stuck.

Now if you have never been to calabar, any map describing it will seem insane to you. But if you are familiar with Yaba left, you will find great use in such a map for Yaba.

That's why some spiritual books (in the Bible) seem useless to you. Unknowingly, among the "useless" books you cited there, are some that are so precious that I could not refrain from answering your post.

Lol..It's obvious that my words have been misunderstood. I didn't say there aren't scriptures in the Bible that are relevant and I also didn't say that all the bible needs is just the 10 commandments. I was just trying to shed more light on what I meant by

You see this is one of the issues I have with the bible or Qur'an.. It's has too many irrelevant details that clouds what people should really focus on.The core values that can make people better human beings.

That been said,I'm someone that sits down and reads Matthew,Luke and John cos there are things you can learn from the life Jesus lived regardless of your beliefs and sometimes you just need to remind yourself of these things.Like trying not to be a hypocrite(Mat 7:3-5) etc. The book of ecclesiastices and proverbs contain words of wisdom. Now a scripture like the songs of Solomon is a very questionable one even among Christians and it's purpose in the bible is yet to deduced(To me).
That's what I meant by irrelevant details.

EmperorHarry:

That's what I meant by irrelevant details.

And we are asking you to consider that the reason you think they are irrelevant is perhaps because you just don't yet see the relevance in them.

budaatum:
"ankh wedja seneb"

"Beloved, I pray that in all respects you may prosper and be in good health, just as your soul prospers (i.e. just as you are strong in spirit.)"
- 3 John 1:2

Maybe what you meant to point out here isn't religion. Religion is an institution founded by a person... Antireligion person can easily see many dogma compounded in each religion. It is there everywhere you turn.

However, it is sometimes difficult to detach oneself from Spirituality (you need to understand differences between religion and spirituality). As Spirituality is life, found itself in every aspect of living. One, either Atheist or theist will fill connected to something or someone outside their world. Could be Music, Art, Natural world or seeking Enlightenment. It could be knowing oneself. All these are spirituality which we cannot breakaway from.

As par Religion, it can be done away with easily. Most importantly, it should be done away with because it beget gullibility, illogicality and glorification of nonsense

We all working with various meanings of religion but I bet we aren't.

Religion is a cultural system of designated behaviors and practices, morals, worldviews, texts, sanctified places, prophecies, ethics, or organizations, that relates humanity to one another using the supernatural, transcendental, or spiritual element. However, there is no scholarly consensus over what precisely constitutes a religion.

Religion is very early societies school for when we couldn't educate everyone nor was everyone capable of learning so we wrote a curriculum and organised to teach it to people regularly. It's not the only school today so long later, but religion teaches the things of its own sphere, the relation of humanity to one other through the supernatural, transcendental, or spiritual elements.

It is the belief of some that the dharma wheel will keep turning until everyone has entered nirvana. Then all shall cease.

budaatum:
We all working with various meanings of religion but I bet we aren't.

Religion is a cultural system of designated behaviors and practices, morals, worldviews, texts, sanctified places, prophecies, ethics, or organizations, that relates humanity to one another using the supernatural, transcendental, or spiritual element. However, there is no scholarly consensus over what precisely constitutes a religion.

[
Religion is very early societies school for when we couldn't educate everyone nor was everyone capable of learning so we wrote a curriculum and organised to teach it to people regularly. It's not the only school today so long later, but religion teaches the things of its own sphere,the relation of humanity to one other through the supernatural, transcendental, or spiritual elements.

It is the belief of some that the dharma wheel will keep turning until everyone has entered nirvana. Then all shall cease.

Exactly!

FOLYKAZE:
Maybe what you meant to point out here isn't religion. Religion is an institution founded by a person... Antireligion person can easily see many dogma compounded in each religion. It is there everywhere you turn.

However, it is sometimes difficult to detach oneself from Spirituality (you need to understand differences between religion and spirituality). As Spirituality is life, found itself in every aspect of living. One, either Atheist or theist will fill connected to something or someone outside their world. Could be Music, Art, Natural world or seeking Enlightenment. It could be knowing oneself. All these are spirituality which we cannot breakaway from.

As par Religion, it can be done away with easily. Most importantly, it should be done away with because it beget gullibility, illogicality and glorification of nonsense

You fail to realize that the same people that corrupted religion will still exist and will still corrupt and manipulate any other alternative for their selfish interest. It's funny you didn't get my point in the first post when I clearly stated that religion just like money isn't the root cause,humans are. Sure it has a lot of errors and some parts of it tends to propagate irrationality but then there are a lot of dumbasses and bird brained followers(People who lack the ability to think and understand certain things by themselves) in these religions. Some of them are downright stupid(A certain part of human population is) and you can't blame that on religion.So what do you do to these kind of people? Have you ever tried to show someone the flaws in the bible like the creation story etc only for you to feel like your talking to yourself.I was there once and at some point I didn't give a damn anymore. People like this exist in abundance.These people are humans and can do good thing and bad things,just like you.The world is turning to shit because religion is largely losing it's hold on humanity and evil is glorified and admired in the world(Particularly Africa) today.Would you blame religion for the actions of fraudsters, "ritualist", Thieves, political thugs(controlled by politicians regardless of their religious beliefs),racists just to mention a few.Do religious doctrines and scriptures kick against these things? Were there commandments written to keep people from doing these things? Are people still doing these things? If yes then why the hell would you think religion should be done away with.There's still a section of the religious population that religion and moral values still has a hold over and that is the reason I still believe religion should not be scrapped cos humanity is ready for a world without it.Take a look at societies that are slowly doing away with religion,they are collectively making conscious efforts to make their society a better place for themselves(These societies aren't entirely devoid of unprogressive minds and perpetrators of evil).That's just like 10-20% of the world population.The rest of humanity is still not there yet and I still doubt we'd ever get there.I'm not saying my theory of how the world would look like without religion is correct but I'd take my chances.
Religion would fizzle out on it's own when the time is right but speeding up the process in my opinion is not a good option.

EmperorHarry:
You fail to realize that the same people that corrupted religion will still exist and will still corrupt and manipulate any other alternative for their selfish interest. It's funny you didn't get my point in the first post when I clearly stated that religion just like money isn't the root cause,humans are. Sure it has a lot of errors and some parts of it tends to propagate irrationality but then there are a lot of dumbasses and bird brained followers(People who lack the ability to think and understand certain things by themselves) in these religions. Some of them are downright stupid(A certain part of human population is) and you can't blame that on religion.So what do you do to these kind of people? Have you ever tried to show someone the flaws in the bible like the creation story etc only for you to feel like your talking to yourself.I was there once and at some point I didn't give a damn anymore. People like this exist in abundance.These people are humans and can do good thing and bad things,just like you.The world is turning to shit because religion is largely losing it's hold on humanity and evil is glorified and admired in the world(Particularly Africa) today.Would you blame religion for the actions of fraudsters, "ritualist", Thieves, political thugs(controlled by politicians regardless of their religious beliefs),racists just to mention a few.Do religious doctrines and scriptures kick against these things? Were there commandments written to keep people from doing these things? Are people still doing these things? If yes then why the hell would you think religion should be done away with.There's still a section of the religious population that religion and moral values still has a hold over and that is the reason I still believe religion should not be scrapped cos humanity is ready for a world without it.Take a look at societies that are slowly doing away with religion,they are collectively making conscious efforts to make their society a better place for themselves(These societies aren't entirely devoid of unprogressive minds and perpetrators of evil).That's just like 10-20% of the world population.The rest of humanity is still not there yet and I still doubt we'd ever get there.I'm not saying my theory of how the world would look like without religion is correct but I'd take my chances.
Religion would fizzle out on it's own when the time is right but speeding up the process in my opinion is not a good option.

On the first note, you need to have a clear picture of what Spirituality and Religion is. While on this, you should be able to identify that that both are bi-polar.

Juggling into the topic, Spirituality is not an alternative to religion. It has been here since the beginning when there is an entity; entity that is is aware and react to it environment. And one important aspect of spirituality is that it is natural, evolve with time and personal. All it offers, however is world connected as one, very different from religion that put one against the world.

On the second note, you acknowledge that religion has it own errors and problems. You have however failed to realise that religion, particularly is the problem. The question should be how, why, and when does it become problem? This is simple...

Using your Love of Money analogy, Human greed and socioeconomic imbalances is the problem. Money doesn't dictates that you should hate or kill. The table turns when socioeconomic problems and greed set in. Hunger, poverty and materialistic mindset could make one steal, kill or hate your opponents.

This cannot be said about religion. Religion on the first note creates a divided world. A world where you love those in your camp and hate those outside. Quran dictates Jew should be killed, Islamic preachers also propagate it. Christians hate idol worshippers because Bible directed them. Many have been killed because the killer were convinced by their religion scriptures.

Love of money has many advantages. Same cannot be said about religion. Apart from giving believers false hope and irrational dream, it has contributed nothing good to humanity as whole. Therefore, an institution that is problematic to humanity, a problem itself to mankind; and has no benefit to society, such institution should be done away with.

You pointed that ritualism is still practised till date in Africa. Stealing, racism and social vices still abound. That is religion and socioeconomic problem. Removing ritualism which is religion problem (because people believe practising ritual and sacrifices to some superpowers will sort their problem and bring blessings), stealing, raping, racism and other social vices abound because religion over the centuries has failed to eliminate these problems. Every religion preaches against (at times support) stealing, raping, racism or any vices. If religion fails to clear the vices, it then should be scrapped. What is the essence of an institution that has been failing over centuries? It should be scrapped.

Bro, in your last note, you admitted countries that have done away with religion are progressing, doing better than religious nation. Does that not connote that religion is the problem and should be scrapped?

FOLYKAZE:

On the second note, you acknowledge that religion has it own errors and problems. You have however failed to realise that religion, particularly is the problem. The question should be how, why, and when does it become problem? This is simple...

I acknowledged that religion isn't perfect and just like any other human invention aimed at uniting people with common beliefs,it is suscepectible to corruption and manipulation.There's a reason why we have differenct groups with different ideologies within the same religion.People choose what they want to believe in.

This cannot be said about religion. Religion on the first note creates a divided world. A world where you love those in your camp and hate those outside. Quran dictates Jew should be killed, Islamic preachers also propagate it. Christians hate idol worshippers because Bible directed them. Many have been killed because the killer were convinced by their religion scriptures.

Aren't there millions of such followers that try to live in a world without hate against one another.Even if there's a hatred towards other religion and it's followers,they don't take any actions that would result in the harm of another human being all in the name of religion.If all Muslims had the same mentality as the average "Islamic terrorist".What kind of world would we live in?! Would you say that there aren't Muslims who do good cos their religion still says so.Don't let your bias cloud your judgement. Like I said earlier we choose what we want to believe in. There is love and hate in all religions but people choose which is the better one.It is a personal decision independent of religion.

Love of money has many advantages. Same cannot be said about religion. Apart from giving believers false hope and irrational dream, it has contributed nothing good to humanity as whole. Therefore, an institution that is problematic to humanity, a problem itself to mankind; and has no benefit to society, such institution should be done away with.

Hope,my friend is what keeps people alive. God is a form of hope and whether God exists or not,hope does.Human consciousness and self awareness is what differenciates us from animals.We know what is good and what is evil.We know what it means to be alive,animals don't. You hear of children that commit suicide,what do you think made them do it? Do these children live in developed countries where life is a lot easier for them? What made them take their lives then? They had lost all hope in the world and humanity. They saw no reason to be alive. Are there less cases of suicide reported in more religious societies with harsh living conditions? Why?Because there's still hope.The belief that something whether it exists or not has a plan for them and no matter what they are going through he knows what they are going through. Yes it is false hope but a much needed one for those who aren't to live without it. Try explaining why God doesn't exist to an open minded theist with and open mind and watch as the glimmer in eyes starts to fade as hope begins to fade.Some would fight back and make sure that all your valid points fall on deaf ears. Their hope rests on a supernatural being and as such they won't let you take that hope away from them.They won't let you take their reason to be alive(This is not true for everyone)

You pointed that ritualism is still practised till date in Africa. Stealing, racism and social vices still abound. That is religion and socioeconomic problem. Removing ritualism which is religion problem (because people believe practising ritual and sacrifices to some superpowers will sort their problem and bring blessings), stealing, raping, racism and other social vices abound because religion over the centuries has failed to eliminate these problems. Every religion preaches against stealing, raping, racism or any vices. If religion fails to clear the vices, it then should be scrapped. What is the essence of an institution that has been failing over centuries? It should be scrapped.

@bolded is all you need to know that humans are the main problem and not entirely religion. I'd like to think religion is keeping a balance in a way we can't really comprehend and disrupting that balance is not an option. If you gave a hungry beggar a plate filled with bread and stones.Would he/she eat both the bread and the stone or would he/she separate the bread from the stone? Humans know what is right and what is wrong but still choose to do whatever they deem fit by them.

Bro, in your last note, you admitted countries that have done away with religion are progressing, doing better than religious nation. Does that not connote that religion is the problem and should be scrapped?

Yes(I can't necessarily say that all non religious societies are doing well just the ones that have allowed science a freedom not given in religious societies) with time it will be.When the human race is mature and ready for a world without it. Bertrand Russell once said "Religion is something leftover from the infancy of our intelligence,it would fade away as we adopt reason and science"..Note the key word there "reason".A huge part of the human population doesn't reason otherwise religion would not be freely manipulated for selfish interests which is one of reasons you are against it.

EmperorHarry:

I acknowledged that religion isn't perfect and just like any other human invention aimed at uniting people with common beliefs,it is suscepectible to corruption and manipulation.There's a reason why we have differenct groups with different ideologies within the same religion.People choose what they want to believe in.

My dear, there is nothing to manipulate in something that is primarily set down to loot from the poor, spread hatred and create unnecessary war. Like I said before, religion dictates that someome should be killed. Many scriptures have this instructions, there is nothing to manipulate there. If the scripture are to be followed down to the letter, there would have been no peace and civility in the globe.

EmperorHarry:
Aren't there millions of such followers that try to live in a world without hate against one another.Even if there's a hatred towards other religion and it's followers,they don't take any actions that would result in the harm of another human being all in the name of religion.If all Muslims had the same mentality as the average "Islamic terrorist".What kind of world would we live in?! Would you say that there aren't Muslims who do good cos their religion still says so.Don't let your bias cloud your judgement. Like I said earlier we choose what we want to believe in. There is love and hate in all religions but people choose which is the better one.It is a personal decision independent of religion.

Deployment of Liberalism, moderation, reasoning, logic and humanism into religion is another issue entirely. I will make a quick note. In Islam, Hausa perceive Yoruba muslims are not devoted to Islamic standards.

Some people out there are liberal, not radicals or fanatics to religion teachings. This happen because they diluted barbaric belief found in these religion. However, it doesn't remove the fact that religion books instructed adherents to hate, despise and kill non believers.

Would you blame a Lion for killing your livestock? Nope. Killing is it nature. Same way a brainwashed person who killed for religion purposes. The problem is religion here.

EmperorHarry:
Hope,my friend is what keeps people alive. God is a form of hope and whether God exists or not,hope does.Human consciousness and self awareness is what differenciates us from animals.We know what is good and what is evil.We know what it means to be alive,animals don't. You hear of children that commit suicide,what do you think made them do it? Do these children live in developed countries where life is a lot easier for them? What made them take their lives then? They had lost all hope in the world and humanity. They saw no reason to be alive. Are there less cases of suicide reported in more religious societies with harsh living conditions? Why?Because there's still hope.The belief that something whether it exists or not has a plan for them and no matter what they are going through he knows what they are going through. Yes it is false hope but a much needed one for those who aren't to live without it. Try explaining why God doesn't exist to an open minded theist with and open mind and watch as the glimmer in eyes starts to fade as hope begins to fade.Some would fight back and make sure that all your valid points fall on deaf ears. Their hope rests on a supernatural being and as such they won't let you take that hope away from them.They won't let you take their reason to be alive(This is not true for everyone)

Religion promises a future in the fairy land where there would be no sickness, pain, death or suffering. Religion posit to know what happens after death.

Everyone would experience suffering or death of loved ones. They hope their been steadfast to their religion doctrines will bring an end to all the pains... It is all hot air, false hope.

EmperorHarry:
@bolded is all you need to know that humans are the main problem and not entirely religion. I'd like to think religion is keeping a balance in a way we can't really comprehend and disrupting that balance is not an option. If you gave a hungry beggar a plate filled with bread and stones.Would he/she eat both the bread and the stone or would he/she separate the bread from the stone? Humans know what is right and what is wrong but still choose to do whatever they deem fit by them.

Yes(I can't necessarily say that all non religious societies are doing well just the ones that have allowed science a freedom not given in religious societies) with time it will be.When the human race is mature and ready for a world without it. Bertrand Russell once said "Religion is something leftover from the infancy of our intelligence,it would fade away as we adopt reason and science"..Note the key word there "reason".A huge part of the human population doesn't reason otherwise religion would not be freely manipulated for selfish interests which is one of reasons you are against it.

This is simple. Who kills; gun or the trigger puller?

How do you blame someone that has lost his senses after been brainwashed nd given false hope?

Religion and rationality walk on parallel opposing path.

Religion has been with us for centuries. It doesn't solve the problem mankind is facing. It, however replenish and multiply it. Such institution in my view has failed and should be scrapped.

What mankind need now is Enlightenment and rationality, not religion.

Well tbh, I kinda agree with you OP. Christianity for e.g. worked for Europeans but not for blacks.

I see Europeans discussing how they need to get back to religion cos it helped in the past

FOLYKAZE:


My dear, there is nothing to manipulate in something that is primarily set down to loot from the poor, spread hatred and create unnecessary war. Like I said before, religion dictates that someome should be killed. Many scriptures have this instructions, there is nothing to manipulate there. If the scripture are to be followed down to the letter, there would have been no peace and civility in the globe.

I'm honestly running out of ideas on how to clarify my opinions so we don't keep going in circles.





Deployment of Liberalism, moderation, reasoning, logic and humanism into religion is another issue entirely. I will make a quick note. In Islam, Hausa perceive Yoruba muslims are not devoted to Islamic standards.

Some people out there are liberal, not radicals or fanatics to religion teachings. This happen because they diluted barbaric belief found in these religion. However, it doesn't remove the fact that religion books instructed adherents to hate, despise and kill non believers.

At this point it is obvious you are looking at religion through the lenses of only Islam. There are over 8 billion people in the world today and Muslims aren't up to half of the human population. Now these "religions" you talk of instruct it's followers to kill the followers of other religions but don't they instruct them to love one another. Is there still hatred and division between the followers of these religions? If yes.Would you still blame it on the religions?
It is easy for you to imagine a world without religion just as it is easy to imagine heaven.It's all perfect in your head until somebody else points out the serious flaws you didn't even think was there. And I also noticed you've decided to put humans into consideration.You believe in humanity from the way you've been talking and I sure hope you don't end up in a situation where you see the evil nature of humanity.

Would you blame a Lion for killing your livestock? Nope. Killing is it nature. Same way a brainwashed person who killed for religion purposes. The problem is religion here.

Same way a political thug would kill innocent people for money.Same way a student would get a gun and use his classmates for target pratice.Same way a woman would give birth and dump the baby to die without thinking twice. Humans are the problem.

Religion promises a future in the fairy land where there would be no sickness, pain, death or suffering. Religion posit to know what happens after death.

Everyone would experience suffering or death of loved ones. They hope their been steadfast to their religion doctrines will bring an end to all the pains... It is all hot air, false hope.

Hope is vital and it's must be exist in one form or another for the sake of humanity. Just as romantic love is also a sham,but somehow we can't help but believe it's real. That's why romantic novels and movies sell.

This is simple. Who kills; gun or the trigger puller?

If there's no trigger puller,would the gun kill?! If the gun isn't loaded,would the gun kill?!

How do you blame someone that has lost his senses after been brainwashed nd given false hope?

It means he didn't have any senses in the first place.My dad was a pastor while I was growing up.I attended every service within the week,morning and evening devotion everyday.Why didn't I become brainwashed? Why did I start asking questions? Why did I start seeing loopholes in the bible? Dude it isn't about brainwashing. If you have sense,you have sense. No two ways about it

Religion and rationality walk on parallel opposing path.

Not entirely true.

Religion has been with us for centuries. It doesn't solve the problem mankind is facing. It, however replenish and multiply it. Such institution in my view has failed and should be scrapped.

Mankind would always face problems. We try to solve our problems and end up creating new ones.Take global warming for example.Would you blame this one on religion too?!

What mankind need now is Enlightenment and rationality, not religion.

Religion has it's issues but it is not entirely to blame for the problems we face in the world today.There are problems that aren't even caused by religion and you know it.The world is in a downward spiral. I usually tell people our world is crashing.Divorce is becoming the new norm(as opposed to a time when religion had a stronghold over humanity).Social media is slowly destroying the real world and promoting fake lifestyles(would you also blame this on religion.Maybe the social media is just like religion).I can't even begin to explain how messed up the world we live in is becoming.You probably know these things already but refuse to focus on creating solutions to these nonreligious problems.
The bottom line is religion or no religion the problem we are facing is us. Humans are the problem and other living and nonliving things that aren't humans are suffering the consequences of our actions.You can never have a perfect world,never!. That's why vegeterians,nudists etc exist.There's always gonna be a rebellion.