paxonel:
you are missing the point I'm making.

bf and gf should not be let's have sex until we get married, it should be instant marriage till death do the couple apart. (whether they will end up do their wedding ceremony or not in the future)

I wished you read message out before responding.

I have defined marriage in the most loose term as possible and this even include when Okoro from Anambra state meet Ene from Rivers state at Ajegunle and the two of them decide to live together as Husband and Wife in the face-me-i-face you Okoro is living.

1. (Spiritual) It becomes a spiritual union (as even God recognises them as spiritually connected)
2. (Society) Their society (Neighborhood in Ajegunle) recognizes them as husband and wife
3. (Legal) :Anyone who henceforth sleep with either Okoro or Ene has committed adultery against the other.

You need to understand that bf/gf is not taken care of in this at all. Why?
The intention and purpose are different.
In marriage, the there is a MUTUAL agreement between the two that "they are husband and wife"!

In bf/gf relationship, there is a MUTUAL understanding that "they are NOT yet husband and wife"!

paxonel:

The society has adopted faulty principles that's why things are not going well with people
no, there is nothing spiritual or legal about marriage, check your dictionary, marriage is simply agreement between the two to live together as one.
It now left for the couple involved to make their marriage spiritual or legal. making marriage spiritual or legal should not be a general idea.
For instance, atheists are not into anything spiritual but it is still their right to get married if they want, the world is a free world.
how is marriage then spiritual if that is so?
Do you really know what it means to say something is spiritual?
totally wrong, I don't know where Africans are getting this wrong diabolical concept from
if the man request from the harlot her hand in marriage right there on that bed of having sex with her and the harlot accept, marriage has started right there at that point. There is nothing anyone can do about it.
as if you are not living in Africa and you don't see what is happening
The ones that has been violated and they are still violating till tomorrow what has culture and the law or legal systems done about them?
A man will abandon his wife and children leaving the woman to cater for the children alone and go for another woman right at the nose of the law and culture, and nothing will happen.

So, you see, it takes only the couple involved to keep to part of the agreement they had with one another for marriage to work, not any culture or legal system can make it work.
I have told you about David and Abigal, there was nothing like culture and legal systems, the bible recorded that Abigail followed Davids men to David immediately, and she became his wife.
Also, the moment Adam saw Eve, he declared, this flesh of my flesh and bone of my bone, from that moment she became his wife.
No culture,
No tradition,
No legal system,
No family,
Nothing.

Note: I'm not kicking against culture or legal system, these things should be optional.
Even me, i got wedded, white wedding in church, i did the traditional rites too. But all I'm saying is i cannot stand in the way of people who can't afford to do these things by bringing laws that they must do them before I recognize that they are married. If i should do a thing like that, that is nonsense!

Infact, in this issue of marriage it's a free world.
Everyone are entitled to do what they like, whether they want to do wedding ceremony or not. But what is important is the agreement the couple had and to willingly keep to that agreement till death do them apart.

I think I have explained why marriage is spiritual, societal and legal (formal/informal). And as per Spiritual, I speak to you as a Christian.

1 Cor 6:16:
"What! know ye not that he which is joined to a harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh ."

I think that you have also used the "principle of exception" or "aberration" occuring to determine what the norm should be now.

Let me give you just two examples:
1. In those days in the Yoruba land. The king can see any beautiful maiden and command that she be taken (literally from the street as his wife). The family of such girl will be notified that "the king has put his feet on your daughter". This is a aberration, but it is recognised even by the society.
2. During wars in the time past, the soldier is entitled to his female captives. Whoever he desires is his wife.

But these two examples even though they exist are not the norm. So is the case of David and Abigail you sites.

Finally, in the culture of BF/GF, the mutual understanding between the couple is NOT as husband and wife BUT friends (with benefits). This doesn't NOT make such a relationship a Marriage relationship. Sexual relationship between this union is thus FORNICATION!

Of course, marriage does not need a formal legal, spiritual and social rules before it becomes a reality BUT let's call a spade a spade.

The couple cannot be JUST be friends and then begin to justify PREMARITAL Sex by feigning what they are not. This is Fornication!


Just a final Scripture:
John 4:17-18:
"The woman answered and said, I have no husband. Jesus said unto her, Thou hast well said, I have no husband: for thou hast had five husbands; and he whom thou now hast is not thy husband : in that saidst thou truly."
The last man seem to be just a mere boyfriend Don't you think so?

I'm sure you agree that a mutual consent for sex between exclusive couple DOES not make them Married!

paxonel:
please help me interprete this scripture.

Romans 9:23-24 New International Version (NIV)

23 What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory
24 even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles?

Is the scripture saying "OBJECT OF HIS MERCY" and "EVEN US " , that these two terms are exclusively independent of one another? meaning, OBJECT OF HIS MERCY and EVEN US are not referring to one and the same thing?

you can start reading it from verse 23 to get the picture of what the scripture is saying.

Your submission was vague, which you were only trying to back up with vague claims. I urge you read from verse 6, so you'd understand better what the whole teachings of paul was all about....MERCY.

And God said He would have mercy on whom He would have mercy and compassion on whom he'd have the same...and paul teaches further that we as human beings( His handiwork) cannot challenge God on that. It's only on whom He would show mercy (that is, the object of Hisercy) that He had prepared in advance for His glory, even Paul himself and the likes (which was why he said "EVEN US" ) who were called not only from the Jews (those who dont believe christ was the messiah until he came and left) but from gentiles (those known for persecuting Christians at that time, including paul himself, who used be called saul before he met Christ on the way to damascus while on same persecuting mission). Hope that's clear enough.

fairfora:
Your submission was vague, which you were only trying to back up with vague claims. I urge you read from verse 6, so you'd understand better what the whole teachings of paul was all about....MERCY.

concerning the Romans 9:23-24 I brought, I was only asking you a question, are the phrases"OBJECT OF HIS MERCY" and "EVEN US" one and the same thing?
I expected a straightforward answer of yes or no.

what is vague in asking a question?

And God said He would have mercy on whom He would have mercy and compassion on whom he'd have the same...and paul teaches further that we as human beings( His handiwork) cannot challenge God on that. It's only on whom He would show mercy (that is, the object of Hisercy) that He had prepared in advance for His glory, even Paul himself and the likes (which was why he said "EVEN US" ) who were called not only from the Jews (those who dont believe christ was the messiah until he came and left) but from gentiles (those known for persecuting Christians at that time, including paul himself, who used be called saul before he met Christ on the way to damascus while on same persecuting mission). Hope that's clear enough.

In summary, you have agreed that the phrases"OBJECT OF HIS MERCY" and "EVEN US" in the context of Romans 9:23-24 refers to one and the same thing?

Yes or no?

shadeyinka:

I wished you read message out before responding.

I have defined marriage in the most loose term as possible and this even include when Okoro from Anambra state meet Ene from Rivers state at Ajegunle and the two of them decide to live together as Husband and Wife in the face-me-i-face you Okoro is living.

1. (Spiritual) It becomes a spiritual union (as even God recognises them as spiritually connected)
2. (Society) Their society (Neighborhood in Ajegunle) recognizes them as husband and wife
3. (Legal) :Anyone who henceforth sleep with either Okoro or Ene has committed adultery against the other.

You need to understand that bf/gf is not taken care of in this at all. Why?
The intention and purpose are different.
In marriage, the there is a MUTUAL agreement between the two that "they are husband and wife"!

In bf/gf relationship, there is a MUTUAL understanding that "they are NOT yet husband and wife"!





I think I have explained why marriage is spiritual, societal and legal (formal/informal). And as per Spiritual, I speak to you as a Christian.

1 Cor 6:16:
"What! know ye not that he which is joined to a harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh ."

I think that you have also used the "principle of exception" or "aberration" occuring to determine what the norm should be now.

Let me give you just two examples:
1. In those days in the Yoruba land. The king can see any beautiful maiden and command that she be taken (literally from the street as his wife). The family of such girl will be notified that "the king has put his feet on your daughter". This is a aberration, but it is recognised even by the society.
2. During wars in the time past, the soldier is entitled to his female captives. Whoever he desires is his wife.

But these two examples even though they exist are not the norm. So is the case of David and Abigail you sites.

Finally, in the culture of BF/GF, the mutual understanding between the couple is NOT as husband and wife BUT friends (with benefits). This doesn't NOT make such a relationship a Marriage relationship. Sexual relationship between this union is thus FORNICATION!

Of course, marriage does not need a formal legal, spiritual and social rules before it becomes a reality BUT let's call a spade a spade.

The couple cannot be JUST be friends and then begin to justify PREMARITAL Sex by feigning what they are not. This is Fornication!


Just a final Scripture:
John 4:17-18:
"The woman answered and said, I have no husband. Jesus said unto her, Thou hast well said, I have no husband: for thou hast had five husbands; and he whom thou now hast is not thy husband : in that saidst thou truly."
The last man seem to be just a mere boyfriend Don't you think so?

I'm sure you agree that a mutual consent for sex between exclusive couple DOES not make them Married!

You did justice to this. God bless you my brother.

damosky12:



You did justice to this. God bless you my brother.

You are welcome.
I wish he would stop justifying sexual immorality in the name of exclusive mutual consent between a man and a woman. A sin is justified only by the un-regenerated. If any man be in Christ, such is a NEW creature...

Shalom

damosky12:

In marriage, the there is a MUTUAL agreement between the two that "they are husband and wife"!

good

In bf/gf relationship, there is a MUTUAL understanding that "they are NOT yet husband and wife"!

And I'm saying that this stereotype does not apply to everyone involving in bf and gf relationship and should not be.
You have to understand that people are not the same, some people are willing to take their bf and gf relationship as a mutual agreement that they are husband and wife.

I think I have explained why marriage is spiritual, societal and legal (formal/informal). And as per Spiritual, I speak to you as a Christian.

you are not close to understand what is spiritual. Church teaches us that anything spiritual is what we can't perceive,for instance the spiritual implication of having sex, but that doesn't apply to reality as sexual intercourse is strictly physical affair.
The attraction is physical,
The act itself is physical,
Even when the woman becomes pregnant and she is giving birth they are all physical.
Therefore, there is nothing like transfer of spirit during sexual intercourse, it is a wrong belief originated from primitive African traditional minds.

But rather, what should be termed spiritual in the context of reality is strictly issues that has to do with ones religious beliefs, whether the person is a Muslim or a Christian or he beliefs in something else.
For instance, you can say there is a spiritual consequence when the government is depriving Christians from attending churches, or Muslims from attending mosques.

1 Cor 6:16:
"What! know ye not that he which is joined to a harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh ."

this scripture is not saying there is anything spiritual between a man who is joined to a harlot. Rather it says they are one flesh, meaning they are one.
Flesh are not spirits.

I think that you have also used the "principle of exception" or "aberration" occuring to determine what the norm should be now.

Let me give you just two examples:
1. In those days in the Yoruba land. The king can see any beautiful maiden and command that she be taken (literally from the street as his wife). The family of such girl will be notified that "the king has put his feet on your daughter". This is a aberration, but it is recognised even by the society.
2. During wars in the time past, the soldier is entitled to his female captives. Whoever he desires is his wife.

But these two examples even though they exist are not the norm. So is the case of David and Abigail you sites.

the bible recorded that Abigail willingly followed David's men to be his wife after the men spoke to her, that is not aberration.
But the examples you gave, the your girl or women had no choice but to comply whether it is their will or not, that is aberration.

Finally, in the culture of BF/GF,

there is no fixed culture of BF/GF, don't generalise. what Africans perceive about bf/gf is not what the rest of the world thinks i will give you example.
Christiano Ronaldo the known football, he has a girlfriend who is a model isn't it. He has been dating that girl only God knows when, the girl has two kids for him and he is dating no other.
Shawn Cater popularly known as Jay Z dated Beyounce since 1999 before the destiny child group. They still remain together till tomorrow with kids.

These are just few to mention.

So what are we saying?

African culture and beliefs are tormenting we Africans in aspect of defining what marriage should be, we don't know.
And we are now taking that torment and traditional beliefs to the church to torment fellow Christians who are ignorant like us, we don't know.
We create laws and demand that they must wed before they are recognize as husband's and wives meanwhile there are no scriptures that says a Christian must do so.

May God forgive us!

the mutual understanding between the couple is NOT as husband and wife BUT friends (with benefits). This doesn't NOT make such a relationship a Marriage relationship. Sexual relationship between this union is thus FORNICATION!

Of course, marriage does not need a formal legal, spiritual and social rules before it becomes a reality BUT let's call a spade a spade.

The couple cannot be JUST be friends and then begin to justify PREMARITAL Sex by feigning what they are not. This is Fornication!


Just a final Scripture:
John 4:17-18:
"The woman answered and said, I have no husband. Jesus said unto her, Thou hast well said, I have no husband: for thou hast had five husbands; and he whom thou now hast is not thy husband : in that saidst thou truly."
The last man seem to be just a mere boyfriend Don't you think so?

I'm sure you agree that a mutual consent for sex between exclusive couple DOES not make them Married!

OK o..

paxonel:
good
And I'm saying that this stereotype does not apply to everyone involving in bf and gf relationship and should not be.
You have to understand that people are not the same, some people are willing to take their bf and gf relationship as a mutual agreement that they are husband and wife.
you are not close to understand what is spiritual. Church teaches us that anything spiritual is what we can't perceive,for instance the spiritual implication of having sex, but that doesn't apply to reality as sexual intercourse is strictly physical affair.
The attraction is physical,
The act itself is physical,
Even when the woman becomes pregnant and she is giving birth they are all physical.
Therefore, there is nothing like transfer of spirit during sexual intercourse, it is a wrong belief originated from primitive African traditional minds.

But rather, what should be termed spiritual in the context of reality is strictly issues that has to do with ones religious beliefs, whether the person is a Muslim or a Christian or he beliefs in something else.
For instance, you can say there is a spiritual consequence when the government is depriving Christians from attending churches, or Muslims from attending mosques.
this scripture is not saying there is anything spiritual between a man who is joined to a harlot. Rather it says they are one flesh, meaning they are one.
Flesh are not spirits.
the bible recorded that Abigail willingly followed David's men to be his wife after the men spoke to her, that is not aberration.
But the examples you gave, the your girl or women had no choice but to comply whether it is their will or not, that is aberration.
there is no fixed culture of BF/GF, don't generalise. what Africans perceive about bf/gf is not what the rest of the world thinks i will give you example.
Christiano Ronaldo the known football, he has a girlfriend who is a model isn't it. He has been dating that girl only God knows when, the girl has two kids for him and he is dating no other.
Shawn Cater popularly known as Jay Z dated Beyounce since 1999 before the destiny child group. They still remain together till tomorrow with kids.

These are just few to mention.

So what are we saying?

African culture and beliefs are tormenting we Africans in aspect of defining what marriage should be, we don't know.
And we are now taking that torment and traditional beliefs to the church to torment fellow Christians who are ignorant like us, we don't know.
We create laws and demand that they must wed before they are recognize as husband's and wives meanwhile there are no scriptures that says a Christian must do so.

May God forgive us!
OK o..

This is my username quoted with Shadeyinka's post. Correct it.

shadeyinka:

You are welcome.
I wish he would stop justifying sexual immorality in the name of exclusive mutual consent between a man and a woman. A sin is justified only by the un-regenerated. If any man be in Christ, such is a NEW creature...

Shalom

Amen.
The Word can not be broken!

expert234:


What do you mean by inter-faithing

Inter-faithing means believing in YHWH as God Almighty and also seeing nothing with joining in when Muslims do their things. You can teal towards Islam and teal towards Christianity at the same time.
Or, you can believe in the concepts of New Age philosophies and that of Christianity at the same time.

In other words Ecumenism. To believe that all roads leads to God.

That is Satan's way, not God's whose name is Jesus.

ornicus:


So get off this website run by an atheist and set up your own platform. Stop prostituting yourself driving traffic here

And the Atheists shd get off this earth becos it is created by my God. How abt that?

Shepherd00:

And the Atheists shd get off this earth becos it is created by my God. How abt that?

Is your God asleep or maybe dead? Call on him to do the needful na.or you can just grab a gun and do it by yourself

damosky12:



This is my username quoted with Shadeyinka's post. Correct it.

thanks, I will correct it.

Shepherd00:

Inter-faithing means believing in YHWH as God Almighty and also seeing nothing with joining in when Muslims do their things. You can teal towards Islam and teal towards Christianity at the same time.
Or, you can believe in the concepts of New Age philosophies and that of Christianity at the same time.

In other words Ecumenism. To believe that all roads leads to God.

That is Satan's way, not God's whose name is Jesus.

Will it interest you to know that true Muslims believe in Jesus Christ?

expert234:


Will it interest you to know that true Muslims believe in Jesus Christ?

LOL. Don't play that card?

Mark 16:15-16
[15]And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
[16]He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Those are the words of Jesus. Believing Him is believing tmHis gospel which is HIS DEATH AND RESURRECTION and the salvation ONLY in His name.

See

1 Corinthians 15:1,3-4
[1]Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you...
[3]For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
[4]And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

No true Muslim believes this...

Did Mohammed believe it?

Isaiah 59 vs 19 "... When the enemy shall come like a flood, the spirit of the LORD shall lift up a standard against him."
....GOD's anointing in us is the capacity to kill thousands of devil's agents, tricks, or troubles.
.... LEARN how to enkindle your anointing

damosky12:



LOL. Don't play that card?

Mark 16:15-16
[15]And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
[16]He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Those are the words of Jesus. Believing Him is believing tmHis gospel which is HIS DEATH AND RESURRECTION and the salvation ONLY in His name.

See

1 Corinthians 15:1,3-4
[1]Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you...
[3]For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
[4]And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

No true Muslim believes this...

Did Mohammed believe it?

If you haven't read the original copy of the Quran, you can't talk about issues relating to the Quran. You don't have enough knowledge to do that and you may end up becoming erroneous in your conclusions.

expert234:


If you haven't read the original copy of the Quran, you can't talk about issues relating to the Quran. You don't have enough knowledge to do that and you may end up becoming erroneous in your conclusions.

My friend, leave original copy of the Quran. Stop being vainly defensive.

The gospel is the death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the ONLY eternal payment for man's sins. (1 Corinth 15:1-4)

This death and resurrection for the remission of man's sins IS the gospel that Jesus' disciples preached throughout their lives.

Acts 4:2,33
[2]Being grieved that they taught the people, and preached through Jesus the resurrection from the dead.

[33]And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.

Acts 17:18
[18]Then certain philosophers of the Epicureans, and of the Stoicks, encountered him. And some said, What will this babbler say? other some, He seemeth to be a setter forth of strange gods: because he preached unto them Jesus, and the resurrection.

Only in believing in Jesus' death and resurrection and receiving the eternal salvation in Jesus' name, is a man saved.

Romans 10:9-10
[9]That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
[10]For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

There is no salvation in any other way.

Acts 4:10-12
[10]Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
[11]This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
[12] Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

It is this same gospel, the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, that Mohammed and Islam (led by the devil) perverted to lead many astray...


157And because of their saying (in boast), “We killed Messiah ‘Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary), the Messenger of Allah,” — but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but the resemblance of ‘Iesa (Jesus) was put over another man (and they killed that man), and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no (certain) knowledge, they follow nothing but conjecture. For surely; they killed him not [i.e. ‘Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary)]: 158But Allah raised him [‘Iesa (Jesus)] up (with his body and soul) unto Himself (and he is in the heavens). And Allah is Ever All-Powerful, All-Wise. (An-Nisa 4:157-158,
Muhsin Khan) 3 4


The foundation of Jesus' finished works stands unshaken nevertheless. He alone is THE WAY (John 14:6).

Islam is just a perversion of this way...

expert234:


Will it interest you to know that true Muslims believe in Jesus Christ?

Will it interest you that true Muslims kill anyone who believes in Jesus Christ?

Have you ever heard what Isis did to anyone who believes in Jesus?

Have you ever met any Muslim convert to Christianity and heard how much their own parents tried to murder them becos they believe in Jesus Christ?

wld it interest you to know that when the muslims catches a Christian, the first thing they try to Make him or her do is to recant his or her faith in Jesus?

Wld it interest you to know that the reason true muslims kill Christians is because of Jesus Christ?

For your information, Isa bin Mariam is not the same person as Jesus Christ of Nazareth.
For, Jesus Christ was the son of God, while Isa was the slave of allah.
Not even ordinary is a slave how much more Jesus Christ the King of Kings.

Muslims are slaves, Christians are Kings according to their Holy Books.

ornicus:


Is your God asleep or maybe dead? Call on him to do the needful na.or you can just grab a gun and do it by yourself

Lol. No, my God is not dead, but you are.

Shepherd00:

Will it interest you that true Muslims kill anyone who believes in Jesus Christ?

Have you ever heard what Isis did to anyone who believes in Jesus?

Have you ever met any Muslim convert to Christianity and heard how much their own parents tried to murder them becos they believe in Jesus Christ?

wld it interest you to know that when the muslims catches a Christian, the first thing they try to Make him or her do is to recant his or her faith in Jesus?

Wld it interest you to know that the reason true muslims kill Christians is because of Jesus Christ?

For your information, Isa bin Mariam is not the same person as Jesus Christ of Nazareth.
For, Jesus Christ was the son of God, while Isa was the slave of allah.
Not even ordinary is a slave how much more Jesus Christ the King of Kings.

Muslims are slaves, Christians are Kings according to their Holy Books.

Lols. You are allowing emotion and half-information to control you.

Any Muslim you see attacking a Christian is not a true Muslim; such is a fake Muslim. True Muslims that understand the Quran will never attack a Christian because a true Muslim believes in the Sanctity of human life.

Any Muslim that attacks others based on religion is not a true Muslim, but a terrorist mascurading as a Muslim.

Muslims had offered me help on several occasions without even bothering to ask about my religion. They only saw another human being in need of help and they helped me without even asking for my name, my church, my religion, my tribe or any such mundane things.

I remember going to several churches in akure when I was a student in FUTA. I was in dire need of financial help to finance my education; will it interest you to know that these churches turned me back, especially because I wasn't a member of their churches?

This is to tell you that even some Muslims are closer to the dictates of the Holy Bible than many Christians.

damosky12:



My friend, leave original copy of the Quran. Stop being vainly defensive.

The gospel is the death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the ONLY eternal payment for man's sins. (1 Corinth 15:1-4)

This death and resurrection for the remission of man's sins IS the gospel that Jesus' disciples preached throughout their lives.

Acts 4:2,33
[2]Being grieved that they taught the people, and preached through Jesus the resurrection from the dead.

[33]And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.

Acts 17:18
[18]Then certain philosophers of the Epicureans, and of the Stoicks, encountered him. And some said, What will this babbler say? other some, He seemeth to be a setter forth of strange gods: because he preached unto them Jesus, and the resurrection.

Only in believing in Jesus' death and resurrection and receiving the eternal salvation in Jesus' name, is a man saved.

Romans 10:9-10
[9]That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
[10]For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

There is no salvation in any other way.

Acts 4:10-12
[10]Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
[11]This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
[12] Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

It is this same gospel, the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, that Mohammed and Islam (led by the devil) perverted to lead many astray...


157And because of their saying (in boast), “We killed Messiah ‘Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary), the Messenger of Allah,” — but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but the resemblance of ‘Iesa (Jesus) was put over another man (and they killed that man), and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no (certain) knowledge, they follow nothing but conjecture. For surely; they killed him not [i.e. ‘Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary)]: 158But Allah raised him [‘Iesa (Jesus)] up (with his body and soul) unto Himself (and he is in the heavens). And Allah is Ever All-Powerful, All-Wise. (An-Nisa 4:157-158,
Muhsin Khan) 3 4


The foundation of Jesus' finished works stands unshaken nevertheless. He alone is THE WAY (John 14:6).

Islam is just a perversion of this way...

A wise Christian knows that it is obvious folly to follow only what is written in the Bible without considering other sources of information.

You think you know, but you are only displaying empty vanity.

Will it interest you to know that the content of the Bible as you know it today is just a fraction of the things that happened in biblical times?

You better be careful with this your stereotypical mindset.

expert234:

Lols. You are allowing emotion and half-information to control you.

Lol, this is your excuse? lame.

expert234:

Any Muslim you see attacking a Christian is not a true Muslim; such is a fake Muslim. True Muslims that understand the Quran will never attack a Christian because a true Muslim believes in the Sanctity of human life.

May be you shd explain this koranic verses to yourself because I understand them better.

Quran 2:19;193[And kill them Wherever find them and turn them out from where they have turn you out[/b]

Quran 47:3-4 Those who disbelief follow falsehood but those who believe follow the truth, so, when you meet them in jihad smite them at their necks till when you have wounded and killed them, then bind a bond firmly on them and take them as slaves. if it had been Allah's will, he himself could have plundered them, but he lets you fight to test you.

Quran 61:4 Surely allah loves those who fight in his way

Quran 2:244 Then fight in the case if Allah, and know that allah careth and knows all things

Quran 4:89 Take no friends from their ranks until they flee on the way of allah. but if they refuse seize them and kill them wherever you find them and take them not as friends and do not accept their help.
these are not Bible verses buy koran and allah is the one talking there not Jesus.

expert234:

Any Muslim that attacks others based on religion is not a true Muslim, but a terrorist mascurading as a Muslim.

according to koran any Muslim who does not kill for allah I'd fake Muslim and will not enter paradise.

Every true koran believing Muslim is a terrorist because he wld practice what is there.

expert234:

Muslims had offered me help on several occasions without even bothering to ask about my religion. They only saw another human being in need of help and they helped me without even asking for my name, my church, my religion, my tribe or any such mundane things.

And that makes them what?

expert234:

I remember going to several churches in akure when I was a student in FUTA. I was in dire need of financial help to finance my education; will it interest you to know that these churches turned me back, especially because I wasn't a member of their churches?

If everyone student went to church to collect money for their education wld there be a Church standing anywhere?
Wld it interest you to know that it's church which sponsored me in the University? And a lot of students are under their scholarship scheme. You don't just walk up to a church and ask for money.
There's a reason why we have families both physical and Covenant. Do you imagine that a family wld have sons and daughters who needs to pay school fees but wld rather give the money out to a stranger who walks Into their house? No, even Jesus said, 'Bread is for children not for dogs'.
If you have a family both biological or Covenant, you call them.

expert234:

This is to tell you that even some Muslims are closer to the dictates of the Holy Bible than many Christians.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

expert234:


A wise Christian knows that it is obvious folly to follow only what is written in the Bible without considering other sources of information.

On the contrary, my dear friend, ANY SANE CHRISTIAN esteems the authority of the Bible above all else...
2 Timothy 3:16
[16]All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Jesus had to say this,
John 5:39
[39]Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

Jesus and ALL his Apostles quoted and taught from only the scriptures (as documented in the old testament Bible)

Similarly, no sane Christian will "consider" the Quran or any other material. That's error!

The foundation of the Lord is established only in the scriptures as documented in the Bible.

1 Corinthians 3:11
[11]For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

Why should we shelve the truth for illusions?

You think you know, but you are only displaying empty vanity.

Yes, I know Jesus Christ.

The old testament prophesied of Him figuratively as the coming lamb of God to save man from sin...

The new testament epistles explain the reality of His death and resurrection of man's ETERNAL SALVATION.

2 Timothy 3:15
[15]And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

Will it interest you to know that the content of the Bible as you know it today is just a fraction of the things that happened in biblical times?

You better be careful with this your stereotypical mindset.

My dear, it is not about the "things". It is about the SINGLE MESSAGE OF THE BIBLE, JESUS CHRIST

Romans 1:1-3
[1]Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,
[2](Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)
[3]Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh.


Romans 3:21-22
[21]But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
[22]Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Moses and all the Prophets spoke of Jesus.

Jesus Himself demonstrated this...


Luke 24:26-27
[26]Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?
[27]And [i] beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself. [i]


HE IS THE SINGLE MESSAGE.

It's Him, the lamb of God who paid for the sins of all, that I see...

ONLY IN HIM can a man be saved from sin.

Acts 4:12
[12]Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Shepherd00:

Lol, this is your excuse? lame.

May be you shd explain this koranic verses to yourself because I understand them better.

Quran 2:19;193[And kill them Wherever find them and turn them out from where they have turn you out[/b]

Quran 47:3-4 Those who disbelief follow falsehood but those who believe follow the truth, so, when you meet them in jihad smite them at their necks till when you have wounded and killed them, then bind a bond firmly on them and take them as slaves. if it had been Allah's will, he himself could have plundered them, but he lets you fight to test you.

Quran 61:4 Surely allah loves those who fight in his way

Quran 2:244 Then fight in the case if Allah, and know that allah careth and knows all things

Quran 4:89 Take no friends from their ranks until they flee on the way of allah. but if they refuse seize them and kill them wherever you find them and take them not as friends and do not accept their help.
these are not Bible verses buy koran and allah is the one talking there not Jesus.


according to koran any Muslim who does not kill for allah I'd fake Muslim and will not enter paradise.

Every true koran believing Muslim is a terrorist because he wld practice what is there.


And that makes them what?

If everyone student went to church to collect money for their education wld there be a Church standing anywhere?
Wld it interest you to know that it's church which sponsored me in the University? And a lot of students are under their scholarship scheme. You don't just walk up to a church and ask for money.
There's a reason why we have families both physical and Covenant. Do you imagine that a family wld have sons and daughters who needs to pay school fees but wld rather give the money out to a stranger who walks Into their house? No, even Jesus said, 'Bread is for children not for dogs'.
If you have a family both biological or Covenant, you call them.


You have no idea what you are talking about.

Lol. You keep on quoting and quoting. In your eyes now, you think you have knowledge, abi?

Do you know how many times the Bible also preaches destruction against people who are of different beliefs? Hope you won't deceive yourself that the Bible didn't command the destruction of unbelievers too?

Imagine the rubbish you said about food for children not for dogs! What a shame. What manner of spiritual arrogance and blindness! So anyone who isn't a member of your church is a dog?! No wonder many so-called Christians will end up in hell.

Those Muslims that help others, don't they have their own responsibilities too?

You need urgent deliverance from Spiritual Arrogance. Calling yourself a Christian doesn't make you a Christian. "By their fruits you shall know them". I think you need to go through 1Corinthians 13 and Matthew 25:35-46. I doubt, however, if your spiritual arrogance will allow you to read those bible verses.

damosky12:


On the contrary, my dear friend, ANY SANE CHRISTIAN esteems the authority of the Bible above all else...
2 Timothy 3:16
[16]All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Jesus had to say this,
John 5:39
[39]Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

Jesus and ALL his Apostles quoted and taught from only the scriptures (as documented in the old testament Bible)

Similarly, no sane Christian will "consider" the Quran or any other material. That's error!

The foundation of the Lord is established only in the scriptures as documented in the Bible.

1 Corinthians 3:11
[11]For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

Why should we shelve the truth for illusions?



Yes, I know Jesus Christ.

The old testament prophesied of Him figuratively as the coming lamb of God to save man from sin...

The new testament epistles explain the reality of His death and resurrection of man's ETERNAL SALVATION.

2 Timothy 3:15
[15]And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.



My dear, it is not about the "things". It is about the SINGLE MESSAGE OF THE BIBLE, JESUS CHRIST

Romans 1:1-3
[1]Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,
[2](Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)
[3]Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh.


Romans 3:21-22
[21]But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
[22]Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Moses and all the Prophets spoke of Jesus.

Jesus Himself demonstrated this...


Luke 24:26-27
[26]Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?
[27]And [i] beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself. [i]


HE IS THE SINGLE MESSAGE.

It's Him, the lamb of God who paid for the sins of all, that I see...

ONLY IN HIM can a man be saved from sin.

Acts 4:12
[12]Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Lolz. Jesus is the Son of God. That's the absolute truth. Have you gone through the Quran by yourself and saw a different teaching?

expert234:


Lolz. Jesus is the Son of God. That's the absolute truth. Have you gone through the Quran by yourself and saw a different teaching?

I don't need to. If I would go through the Quran, I might have to go through the Jewish Toledut , The Buddhists and Hinduism books, the Ifa corpus , as well as the hundreds of other religion documents in the world.

But, note, religions are perspectives, thinkings and ways of men...

Jesus is God's single message to the world. He, alone, is the proof of God's salvation for man.

To receive Him, his death and resurrection, is to receive God's salvation.

To reject Him is to reject God's salvation...

See what he said;

John 3:17-18
[17]For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
[18]He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Give this gospel a trial my friend.

damosky12:




I don't need to. If I would go through the Quran, I might have to go through the Jewish Toledut , The Buddhists and Hinduism books, the Ifa corpus , as well as the hundreds of other religion documents in the world.

But, note, religions are perspectives, thinkings and ways of men...

Jesus is God's single message to the world. He, alone, is the proof of God's salvation for man.

To receive Him, his death and resurrection, is to receive God's salvation.

To reject Him is to reject God's salvation...

See what he said;

John 3:17-18
[17]For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
[18]He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Give this gospel a trial my friend.

It simply means you aren't qualified to talk about muslims since you don't even know shiit about Islam. Never talk about others if you are not in their shoes.

expert234:


It simply means you aren't qualified to talk about muslims since you don't even know shiit about Islam. Never talk about others if you are not in their shoes.

At least, I know that Islam rejects the death and resurrection of Christ, not to talk of the remissions of sins...

I know a few facts about Mohammed and the origin of Islam, but let's leave that...

Would you honestly follow Mohammed ? Will you honestly want to lead his example (s)?

damosky12:



At least, I know that Islam rejects the death and resurrection of Christ, not to talk of the remissions of sins...

Where is your evidence about this; I mean a Quran-backed evidence?

No evidence, Right?

Stop talking about things about which you have no evidence. Have you so learned Christ?

expert234:


Where is your evidence about this; I mean a Quran-backed evidence?

No evidence, Right?

Stop talking about things about which you have no evidence. Have you so learned Christ?

Why are you doing this, my friend?

I'll help you,

Sura 4:157-158: " They [the Jews] slew him[Jesus] not nor crucified [him], but it appeared so unto them...they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain, But Allah took him up unto Himself."






However, what did Jesus say:

We are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be betrayed to the chief priests and the teachers of the law. They will condemn him to death and will turn him over to the Gentiles to be mocked and flogged and crucified. On the third day he will be raised to life! (Matt. 20:18-19).


If you have any Quranic verses that authenticates the death and resurrection of Christ for mankind, kindly reply me with them.

damosky12:


Wh hiy are you doing this, my friend?

I'll help you,

Sura 4:157-158: " They [the Jews] slew him[Jesus] not nor crucified [him], but it appeared so unto them...they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain, But Allah took him up unto Himself."








However, what did Jesus say:

We are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be betrayed to the chief priests and the teachers of the law. They will condemn him to death and will turn him over to the Gentiles to be mocked and flogged and crucified. On the third day he will be raised to life! (Matt. 20:18-19).


If you have any Quranic verses that authenticates the death and resurrection of Christ for mankind, kindly reply me with them.

Have you seen what I'm talking about? You are a Jon Snow; you know nothing. Do you realize that there is a difference between the Quran and Surat?

You obviously do not know.

You aren't qualified to talk about Islam; you know nothing about it

expert234:


Have you seen what I'm talking about? You are a Jon Snow; you know nothing. Do you realize that there is a difference between the Quran and Surat?

You obviously do not know.

You aren't qualified to talk about Islam; you know nothing about it

Ok. Thanks for the blessed compliments.
I quoted from the Surah

See this:.

"A Surah is the term for a chapter of the Quran . There are 114 surahs in the Quran, 86 are classified as Makki, while 28 are Madini..."

Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surah


Can you please enlighten Wikipedia


BTW, I gave my evidence.


Again, I repeat,
Please, if you have any Quranic verse that authenticates the death and resurrection of Christ for mankind, kindly reply me with them.