fortran12:

Did u see the definitions you gave? So if it means all you stated, and every one knows you can't see a spirit. So by logic you eliminate all definitions that involve literal seeing.

AntiChristian:


If you see your brother face to face what does it mean?

fortran12:

From the definitions you gave it can mean i.see.his face, we had an intense conversation, or i felt his presence. Humans are physical beings. Only the first two apply to us. God is a spirit being. You cannot see his face unless you are no longer in your physical form cos humans are in 3 part. Spirit soul and body. The spirit does not die only the physical does.

AntiChristian:


It's either your Bible is wrong by using face to face or you are wrong in your theory! Both can't be right!

fortran12:

The examples i gave fall in your definition of face to face yes or no. just cos it does not fit your narrative does not mean its wrong. I clearly used the definitions you gave.

AntiChristian:


You are twisting texts!

If I tell you I say a spirit face to face does it mean I only saw it somehow but didn't really see it?

Stop twisting words!

fortran12:

Look at your definitions did i define outside it? If you say u saw a spirit face to face if we have to choose the literal definition among all the ones you quoted. It means the person is dead. I come to this conclusion because the spirit ( God) who you saw said that no one can see his face and live. The only logical explanation of people who saw God face to face and lived has to exclude the literal seeing his face. Your definitions of face to face is truthful but why are you ignoring all the logical ones and sticking with the illogical one?

AntiChristian:


When Thomas saw resurrected Jesus face to face was he a spirit or human?

Thomas was able to touch him.

Thomas called him my lord and my god.

Jesus had died already. So we expect his body to have died.

AntiChristian:
I don't think that Jesus' orders were ethical at this point. You must ask the owner for permission to borrow something from him or at least buy it or rent it from him. Some will argue that Jesus needed the donkey to fulfill a prophecy. But why would God want Jesus to commit a sin in order to fulfill a prophecy?

fortran12:

Jesus himself asked Thomas to touch him and he even ate food with them. Jesus died and rose. He was not a spirit. When the disciples saw him and were afraid and said its a ghost Jesus said to them "its i myself. Touch me and see, a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see i have" - luke 24 vs 39.
Therefore, he was not in spirit form. They saw him and touched him.

AntiChristian:


This confirms he never died!

fortran12:

So when he came into the room whn the doors were locked or when the felt the print on his hands and legs he did not die? All his body went thru post crucifixion and on the crucifixion day you still think he did not die? He was put in a tomb with the stone covering and guards at the entrance. So pls tell me how did he escape. Beaten with whips that had sharp objects within, Piece at the side with a spear, had nine inch spikes go thru his hands and feet. Try seeing passion of the Christ to see how gory it was. Also note Mel Gibson said they had to tone down the gore so they could receive an R-rating.

AntiChristian:


If Jesus was completely human and he died, no human will die and remain human! Jesus who acclaimed he had been been given all authority can not be killed by mere spear and beating! And Angels can open the tomb for him who raised a dead person!

AntiChristian:


If Jesus was completely human and he died, no human will die and remain human! Jesus who acclaimed he had been been given all authority can not be killed by mere spear and beating! And Angels can open the tomb for him who raised a dead person!

fortran12:


You forgot the part where he said he will lay down his life and take it up again. His mission was to die for sin. Jesus was the 2nd person in the trinity who took on the form of man to save man. You cannot kill God, its impossible.
He given authority means he has all power, including power over death. and he proved this by rising up from the dead.
What exactly is your point?

AntiChristian:


My point is that Jesus never died! You said in our previous convo that physical can only see physical beings! If Jesus died then he won't still be physically inclined! If he had all authority then he should not die.

He gave a parable of the sign of Jonah. That as Jonah was in the belly of the fish......so also will the son of man be in the ground.

Did Jonah die in the fish?

fortran12:

He died and rose up. So how does the physical part connect? He died physical he rose up physical.
He has all authority so how will he prove he has authority over death is it not by dying and rising up?.
He also said he will die and be raised up again. And this was not a parable. He mentions this severally

AntiChristian:


Jesus gave a parable of the sign of Jonah. That as Jonah was in the belly of the fish......so also will the son of man be in the ground.

Did Jonah die in the fish?

fortran12:

Was that the only one he said? You wilfully ignored the ones where he said he will die and rise. Be truthful. Dont cherry pick

AntiChristian:


Did Jonah die in the Fish?

fortran12:


This is the exact quote
'39 Jesus replied, “A wicked and adulterous generation demands a sign, but none will be given it except the sign of the prophet Jonah. 40 For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.'

as you can see he was talking about being under the earth for 3 days like jonah in the whale. So your question about Jonah dying is irrelevant. Its not the point Jesus was making. Always be truthful, Stop cherry picking. You have no case

AntiChristian:


Did Jonah die in the Fish? No! The fish spilled Jonah alive!

Bye!