ErnestNc:
[size=7pt][/size]My guy.
You all can't force us to believe in your doctrines. I can bring out any scripture and interpret it the way I want ,just as how you all misinterpret John 1 and Hebrews 1.
It's sad you don't know the spirit of truth . The same spirit you don't believe can speak to anyone . You don't believe in the grace and power of God , but only self righteousness and arguments are your tributaries.
You deny the deity of Christ. Some of you lots even describe him as the arc angel Michael.
I can't even begin to mention the errors you have chosen to believe. I can't tell you not to believe . But this I know, Jesus crucified and glorified alone.

So keep your religion while i keep mine since you have a reason for whatever you believe just as i also have a reason for whatever i believe.

Thanks!

MaxInDHouse:


Old Testament accepted by all Jews or the New Testament written by Jesus' disciples?

The old testament , the prophecies of the prophets and the psalms of David shows he's the messiah.

Only folks who are blinded and people who have been marked for destruction won't be able to see it, Even the Jews.

ErnestNc:

The old testament , the prophecies of the prophets and the psalms of David shows he's the messiah.

So just as millions of Jews including majority of religious leaders in the first century had those prophecies, in fact they're the ones who taught Jesus' disciples what lead them to believe in Jesus yet they disagreed saying Jesus is not the Christ just as you're also doing today!

AkinwaleJJ:

So just as millions of Jews including majority of religious leaders in the first century had those prophecies, in fact they're the ones who taught Jesus' disciples what lead them to believe in Jesus yet they disagreed saying Jesus is not the Christ just as you're also doing today!

Who's is disagreeing that Jesus isn't Christ except you religious fanatics that claim Jesus is the same as Angel Michael?

ErnestNc:

Who's is disagreeing that Jesus isn't Christ

Millions of Jews living in Jerusalem today and millions of Jews who lived in Jerusalem during Jesus' lifetime disagreed Sir, in fact they will tell you that Jesus and his disciples were scammers!

Maximus692:


Millions of Jews living in Jerusalem today and millions of Jews who lived in Jerusalem during Jesus' lifetime disagreed Sir, in fact they will tell you that Jesus and his disciples were scammers!

And rightly so...

God never told them he had a son he was sending as a sin sacrifice.....

Where ever the Romans got the idea from.. definitely not from the Tanakh...

ErnestNc:



The old testament , the prophecies of the prophets and the psalms of David shows he's the messiah.

Only folks who are blinded and people who have been marked for destruction won't be able to see it, Even the Jews.

Will you mind sharing the old testament quotes relating to jesus?

Maximus692:


Millions of Jews living in Jerusalem today and millions of Jews who lived in Jerusalem during Jesus' lifetime disagreed Sir, in fact they will tell you that Jesus and his disciples were scammers!

This is a known fact. But you addressed me like one who is an unbeliever, hence my question.

sonmvayina:


Will you mind sharing the old testament quotes relating to jesus?

Are you feigning ignorance or you haven't read the scriptures before?

ErnestNc:

This is a known fact. But you addressed me like one who is an unbeliever, hence my question.

Of course you're an unbeliever because they don't dispute what the majority they like agree to it's only things they dislike that they will not like to believe even though there are scriptural and social proofs!

If you say you believe that Jesus of Nazareth is the promised Messiah but you were never there to witness what his disciples penned down what proof do you have other than the fact that majority you like have accepted what Jesus' disciples wrote?

I believe that Jesus of Nazareth is the promised Messiah not because of the conviction of his disciples but the story of his life how it fulfilled the prophecy regarding the Messiah in an accurate way.

John the baptist heard from God that the Christ will come for baptism and God's Holy Spirit will descend on him {John 1:33} and it happened exactly as God told John the baptist {Matthew 3:16} despite all these John still doubt if Jesus is the promised Messiah, so he sent his disciples to go and ask Jesus! Matthew 11:2-3

Please what on earth could have prompted John the baptist to doubt Jesus' authenticity?

Well it's due to wrong expectations!

John knew through the prophecies that the Christ will come and establish righteous rule throughout the earth {Daniel 2:44} and during his reign the righteous will flourish! Psalms 72:7

If that is true then why is John a righteous man and prophet of God arrested and imprisoned when the Christ is around?

So what response did Jesus gave John who was anticipating a release by the King of kings if truly Jesus is the promised Messiah?

Well Jesus only told John's disciples to go and tell John what they're seeing which are the part of the prophecies that Christ will fulfill at that point in time {Matthew 11:4-5 compare to Isaiah 35:5-6; 61:1} in fact Jesus added that John should be careful not to stumble due to wrong expectations.

So if we JWs believe that Jesus is around since 1914 and we're pointing to the WORKS he is doing using imperfect humans today whatever you choose to think, say or do doesn't matter to us because we know that's how people like you criticized Jesus' disciples who also claim that the Christ has come in the first century! Matthew 5:11-12

I know you've been looking for opportunity to deviate from the key issue on this thread.

Maximus692:
So if we JWs believe that Jesus is around since 1914

Then nobody would have criticized JWs for that since it's JWs believe but saying it's Biblical it's wrong.

So Jesus presence hasn't happened according your to Matt 24:26-37.

JWs should Just admit the wrong teaching as they once did in the past.

and we're pointing to the WORKS he is doing using imperfect humans today whatever you choose to think, say or do doesn't matter to us because we know that's how people like you criticized Jesus' disciples who also claim that the Christ has come in the first century! Matthew 5:11-12

Talking about WORK it's not new to Christianity, if people didn't WORK, C.T Russell won't know about the Gospel before he started his movement that some crooks later change to JWs as known today.

And evidence of WORK among Christianity today is everywhere despite your brothers persecution of the Body of Christ.

Maximus692:


Of course you're an unbeliever because they don't dispute what the majority they like agree to it's only things they dislike that they will not like to believe even though there are scriptural and social proofs!

If you say you believe that Jesus of Nazareth is the promised Messiah but you were never there to witness what his disciples penned down what proof do you have other than the fact that majority you like have accepted what Jesus' disciples wrote?

I believe that Jesus of Nazareth is the promised Messiah not because of the conviction of his disciples but the story of his life how it fulfilled the prophecy regarding the Messiah in an accurate way.

John the baptist heard from God that the Christ will come for baptism and God's Holy Spirit will descend on him {John 1:33} and it happened exactly as God told John the baptist {Matthew 3:16} despite all these John still doubt if Jesus is the promised Messiah, so he sent his disciples to go and ask Jesus! Matthew 11:2-3

Please what on earth could have prompted John the baptist to doubt Jesus' authenticity?

Well it's due to wrong expectations!

John knew through the prophecies that the Christ will come and establish righteous rule throughout the earth {Daniel 2:44} and during his reign the righteous will flourish! Psalms 72:7

If that is true then why is John a righteous man and prophet of God arrested and imprisoned when the Christ is around?

So what response did Jesus gave John who was anticipating a release by the King of kings if truly Jesus is the promised Messiah?

Well Jesus only told John's disciples to go and tell John what they're seeing which are the part of the prophecies that Christ will fulfill at that point in time {Matthew 11:4-5 compare to Isaiah 35:5-6; 61:1} in fact Jesus added that John should be careful not to stumble due to wrong expectations.

So if we JWs believe that Jesus is around since 1914 and we're pointing to the WORKS he is doing using imperfect humans today whatever you choose to think, say or do doesn't matter to us because we know that's how people like you criticized Jesus' disciples who also claim that the Christ has come in the first century! Matthew 5:11-12

Jesus has always been around abeg.

1914 is hoax.

What baffles me is You guys claim angel Michael is the Christ . Lol.

Jws are just anti ChristS in disguise .

ErnestNc:

angel Michael is the Christ!

Just ask for what you don't know because there are over 41,000 different sects all claiming Christians with contradicting teachings and conflicting doctrines.
So singling one out shows you've noticed how faithful and dedicated the adherents of this faith are unlike those faithless miscreants around you!

Maximus692:
Just ask for what you don't know because there are over 41,000 different sects all claiming Christians with contradicting teachings and conflicting doctrines.

And JWs is among those 41,000 different sects claiming Christians with contradictory teachings.

Or are you not a Christian anymore?

Emusan:

And JWs is among those 41,000 different sects claiming Christians with contradictory teachings. Or are you not a Christian anymore?

Why not calm down and allow two persons talk nah?
Must you always trail JWs up and down?

Maximus692:
Why not calm down and allow two persons talk nah?

On the forum you design or the one Watchtower form

Don't deviate Mr

Since you're now claiming to be a Christian, is JWs among 41,000 sects claiming Christians with contradictory teachings?

That was a simple question.

Must you always trail JWs up and down?

Smile...

Says someone who doesn't have rest of mind and changing moniker up and down

ErnestNc:


Are you feigning ignorance or you haven't read the scriptures before?

This is not the answer to my query...

I am yet to see any jesus in the Tanakh..

Show me...

Emusan:

On the forum you design or the one Watchtower form
Don't deviate Mr
Since you're now claiming to be a Christian, is JWs among 41,000 sects claiming Christians with contradictory teachings?
That was a simple question.
Smile...
Says someone who doesn't have rest of mind and changing moniker up and down

Mo ti gbàgbé pé ẹlẹ́tẹ̀ ni ẹ́, tóò bá tíì tẹ́ kìí ti ẹ lọ́rùn.

So keep on asking! Matthew 7:7-8

sonmvayina:


This is not the answer to my query...

I am yet to see any jesus in the Tanakh..

Show me...

You came for dispute and not to learn.
You want to patronise me.

When I see teachable people I know.


Anyways, there are more than 50 verses of scriptures to my best knowledge that points that Jesus is the Christ by description and manifestation.

Maximus692:


Just ask for what you don't know because there are over 41,000 different sects all claiming Christians with contradicting teachings and conflicting doctrines.
So singling one out shows you've noticed how faithful and dedicated the adherents of this faith are unlike those faithless miscreants around you!

Is angel Michael the Christ and Messiah?

Yes or no ?

ErnestNc:


You came for dispute and not to learn.
You want to patronise me.

When I see teachable people I know.


Anyways, there are more than 50 verses of scriptures to my best knowledge that points that Jesus is the Christ by description and manifestation.

I don't see any actual teaching..
I wonder what I should learn?

Show me the over 50 verses...

Even if it is 1 or 2

Maximus692:
Mo ti gbàgbé pé ẹlẹ́tẹ̀ ni ẹ́, tóò bá tíì tẹ́ kìí ti ẹ lọ́rùn.

He will soon accuse Jesus and His apostles making a statement like this

So keep on asking! Matthew 7:7-8

Matt 24:26-27 says what again?

sonmvayina:


I don't see any actual teaching..
I wonder what I should learn

You're right. Absolutely nothing to learn...

ErnestNc:

Is angel Michael the Christ and Messiah?
Yes or no?

Let me throw your own comment back at you:

ErnestNc:

You came for dispute and not to learn.
You want to patronise me.
When I see teachable people I know.

So if you want to LEARN that's not how to go about it.
You supposed to say:

"Please help me with the scriptural backing which convinced you that Jesus is the same as Archangel Michael"

Ọmọ no be gra-gra after all you've seen how efficacious i defended the fact that Jesus returned to this planet in the year 1914.
So you now know that it's not just them say, therefore if you want to learn you must humbly ask. I'm a fully competent disciples studying the Bible with many who are old enough to be your grandpa!

Maximus692:

Let me throw your own comment back at you:



So if you want to LEARN that's not how to go about it.
You supposed to say:

"Please help me with the scriptural backing which convinced you that Jesus is the same as Archangel Michael"

Ọmọ no be gra-gra after all you've seen how efficacious i defended the fact that Jesus returned to this planet in the year 1914.
So you now know that it's not just them say, therefore if you want to learn you must humbly ask. I'm a fully competent disciples studying the Bible with many who are old enough to be your grandpa!

Sense will not finish you 🤣🤣

ErnestNc:

Sense will not finish you 🤣🤣

You can imagine!

See how he boldly lied that he defended Jesus actually returned to this planet Earth in 1914

When I showed him Matt 24:26-27 he went ghost mode.

That's the best he can do, boasting on his ignorance but when confronted with Bible verses he will switch to another format.

ErnestNc:

Sense will not finish you 🤣🤣

Hen nah!
I am Maximus one of Jehovah's Witnesses the one and only group having fully competent and completely equipped preachers and teachers of God's word unlike you people who claim you're Christians but can't defend what you think you know!
So go and keep what you know so that i also keep mine at least each person agree God exist and that he is worshiping God it's our understanding that differs. So if you will not humbly request for what i believe then there's no need talking as if someone is wrong!

Emusan:

You can imagine! See how he boldly lied that he defended Jesus actually returned to this planet Earth in 1914 :DWhen I showed him Matt 24:26-27 he went ghost mode. That's the best he can do, boasting on his ignorance but when confronted with Bible verses he will switch to another format.

As he dey pain unah nah so he dey sweet us!

You people have what your pastors are teaching you but you're not contented with it it's always what JWs are teaching that's your problem whereas two out of all your churches aren't teaching the same thing because if they do there is no need pitching tents separately.

Our leaders taught us that Jesus returned in the year 1914 just as Jesus' disciples taught those listening to them that the Christ has come and gone in the first century.

The only evidence Jesus' disciples had back then is fulfilled prophecies that time exactly the same thing Jehovah's Witnesses have as evidence today that fulfilment of prophecies from 1914 till now is evidence that Jesus has returned.

So i don't know why you people are so worried about JW's teachings if you're fully convinced of what your teachers are teaching you!

Maximus692:


Hen nah!
I am Maximus one of Jehovah's Witnesses the one and only group having fully competent and completely equipped preachers and teachers of God's word unlike you people who claim you're Christians but can't defend what you think you know!
So go and keep what you know so that i also keep mine at least each person agree God exist and that he is worshiping God it's our understanding that differs. So if you will not humbly request for what i believe then there's no need talking as if someone is wrong!

So God told you his only begotten son is angel Michael?
Please point to me in the scriptures where we can find that. Since you claim to be a "well equipped teacher of God"

Please I want to learn .

ErnestNc:

So God told you his only begotten son is angel Michael?

Unlike you and your pastors deceiving yourselves claiming God/Jesus use to speak with you privately we rely solely on what is found written in God's word and His Holy Spirit directs us to scriptures needed to help us arrive at the right conclusion.
So we don't say God speaks to us that way that's why we make strong disciples who are fully competent and completely equipped to preach and teach since everything they needed for the preaching work is found in the Bible so they can point to verses in God's word!

ErnestNc:

Please point to me in the scriptures where we can find that. Since you claim to be a "well equipped teacher of God"
Please I want to learn .

With the highlighted i will show you what we found in the Bible it's God's Holy Spirit (spirit of pureness and sincerity) that will guide your mental powers to conviction that you've found God's people if you're honest hearted and sincere in your findings so that you will find PEACE in what you're learning! Philippians 4:7

In the beginning God was with one spirit being who was created in God's image {Proverbs 8:22 compare to John 1:1-2} this spirit son of God spent uncountable years with his father until the father decided to give this child an inheritance but he also must work alongside his father as a master workman {Proverbs 8:30} that's why the Bible called Jesus the firstborn of all creations! Colossians 1:15

So the first assignment was to create heaven and since this child is a spirit himself along with his father that was easy for him so God's word said "in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" {Genesis 1:1} note what the next verse say ",and the earth was without form" {Genesis 1:2} this is because the work is no longer about spiritual realms but physical so the son of God needs guidance to do this work, that's why his father stepped in and started directing him on each step to take in the creation of physical things.

The father uses an energy called God's Holy Spirit to accomplish all His purposes so the Bible says "the spirit of God was moving over the waters" {Genesis 1:2} from then you will notice that a voice was instructing someone saying "let this or that be done like ....." {Genesis 1:3, 6, 9, 11,14, 20, 24, 26} that's God's voice instructing His only begotten son on how to work on physical creations!

So it's established that there were two persons that started all this things in the beginning! John 1:1-2

But then how did we know that the second person is the one later known as Archangel Michael?

The word "Archangel" means the angel whose position is higher than all others and only Michael was referred to with that title {Jude 9} all angels are God's spirit sons {Job 1:6; 38:7} the place God created for them to live is heaven while earth is designed for humans! Psalms 115:16
According to Daniel's and Jude's account Satan who is also an angel but rebellious fear only one angel and that's Michael {Daniel 10:13; Jude 6} and Michael is the angel standing for the salvation of God's people {Daniel 12:1} he is the same person who can resurrected the dead with just a call {1Thessalonians 4:16 compare to John 11:43-44} Michael is the commander of all the angels in heaven {Revelations 12:7 compare to Matthew 13:41; 25:31} while Satan is the head of all rebellious angels.

After the creation of heaven and earth with all the things made God's craftsman said "i love humans the most" Proverbs 8:31 and God decreed that whoever disregard this person will be destroyed! Proverbs 8:34 compare to John 3:16

Of course you will be waiting for where the Bible will tell you directly that "Jesus is archangel Michael" but that is not the case remember how God's word foretold that Elijah will come before the Christ {Malachi 4:5} only for Jesus to say John has taken that part and the scriptures say "Emmanuel will be the name of the Christ" Isaiah 7:14 only for Gabriel to tell Joseph that Jesus should be his name! Matthew 1:21

Who will convince unbelieving Jews till today that the Elijah they were expecting has come as John the baptist or that the Messiah whose name according to the scriptures will be Emmanuel has come as Jesus of Nazareth?

Well if you believe in God's word you shouldn't have any problem with this because after Jesus (archangel Michael) returned in 1914 the organization of Jehovah's Witnesses kept growing and moving into all the corners of the earth making strong disciples just as he ordered! Matthew 28:18-20

So it's either you agree or disagree there's no need for arguments but if you have further questions let me know!

sonmvayina:

And rightly so...
God never told them he had a son he was sending as a sin sacrifice.....Where ever the Romans got the idea from.. definitely not from the Tanakh...

Guy get out of my mention, Jesus is the promised Messiah.
I have trashed you several times on this issue to the extent you started crying for HellFire which you don't believe to come!

Maximus692:

Unlike you and your pastors deceiving yourselves claiming God/Jesus use to speak with you privately we rely solely on what is found written in God's word and His Holy Spirit directs us to scriptures needed to help us arrive at the right conclusion.
So we don't say God speaks to us that way that's why we make strong disciples who are fully competent and completely equipped to preach and teach since everything they needed for the preaching work is found in the Bible so they can point to verses in God's word!


With the highlighted i will show you what we found in the Bible it's God's Holy Spirit (spirit of pureness and sincerity) that will guide your mental powers to conviction that you've found God's people if you're honest hearted and sincere in your findings so that you will find PEACE in what you're learning! Philippians 4:7

In the beginning God was with one spirit being who was created in God's image {Proverbs 8:22 compare to John 1:1-2} this spirit son of God spent uncountable years with his father until the father decided to give this child an inheritance but he also must work alongside his father as a master workman {Proverbs 8:30} that's why the Bible called Jesus the firstborn of all creations! Colossians 1:15

So the first assignment was to create heaven and since this child is a spirit himself along with his father that was easy for him so God's word said "in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" {Genesis 1:1} note what the next verse say ",and the earth was without form" {Genesis 1:2} this is because the work is no longer about spiritual realms but physical so the son of God needs guidance to do this work, that's why his father stepped in and started directing him on each step to take in the creation of physical things.

The father uses an energy called God's Holy Spirit to accomplish all His purposes so the Bible says "the spirit of God was moving over the waters" {Genesis 1:2} from then you will notice that a voice was instructing someone saying "let this or that be done like ....." {Genesis 1:3, 6, 9, 11,14, 20, 24, 26} that's God's voice instructing His only begotten son on how to work on physical creations!

So it's established that there were two persons that started all this things in the beginning! John 1:1-2

But then how did we know that the second person is the one later known as Archangel Michael?

The word "Archangel" means the angel whose position is higher than all others and only Michael was referred to with that title {Jude 9} all angels are God's spirit sons {Job 1:6; 38:7} the place God created for them to live is heaven while earth is designed for humans! Psalms 115:16
According to Daniel's and Jude's account Satan who is also an angel but rebellious fear only one angel and that's Michael {Daniel 10:13; Jude 6} and Michael is the angel standing for the salvation of God's people {Daniel 12:1} he is the same person who can resurrected the dead with just a call {1Thessalonians 4:16 compare to John 11:43-44} Michael is the commander of all the angels in heaven {Revelations 12:7 compare to Matthew 13:41; 25:31} while Satan is the head of all rebellious angels.

After the creation of heaven and earth with all the things made God's craftsman said "i love humans the most" Proverbs 8:31 and God decreed that whoever disregard this person will be destroyed! Proverbs 8:34 compare to John 3:16

Of course you will be waiting for where the Bible will tell you directly that "Jesus is archangel Michael" but that is not the case remember how God's word foretold that Elijah will come before the Christ {Malachi 4:5} only for Jesus to say John has taken that part and the scriptures say "Emmanuel will be the name of the Christ" Isaiah 7:14 only for Gabriel to tell Joseph that Jesus should be his name! Matthew 1:21

Who will convince unbelieving Jews till today that the Elijah they were expecting has come as John the baptist or that the Messiah whose name according to the scriptures will be Emmanuel has come as Jesus of Nazareth?

Well if you believe in God's word you shouldn't have any problem with this because after Jesus (archangel Michael) returned in 1914 the organization of Jehovah's Witnesses kept growing and moving into all the corners of the earth making strong disciples just as he ordered! Matthew 28:18-20

So it's either you agree or disagree there's no need for arguments but if you have further questions let me know!

Where in the scriptures did Jesus say I am the arch angel Michael? Did Michael not dispute over Moses's body with Satan? Where in the bible was it stated that Michael created all things?

[Hebrews 1:5-8 KJV

For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

[6] And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

[7] And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.
[8] But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O
GOD, is for ever and ever: a f sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

Do you now see that you're in an antichrist organisation?

God sent his son and not Michael to die for our sins. A fallen angel has given y'all false doctrines.

If an angel from heaven or anyman gives to us another doctrine other than the gospel of Christ let him be accursed. My friend you are cursed.