Hiswordxray:


You are not an atheist, that is just a pretend.
You are called by God.
So stop this atheist claim and stop deceiving yourself.

JackBizzle:



When you become a muslim, I will become a christian

no. U will av to be a muslim den... because dat means I've found life in islam and u must choose life too.

Kay17:


I don't feel guilt neither i do fear Hell

Yes that word "guilty "
What did you do that make you feel guilty?
No matter what it might be God will forgive you.
You can't run away from God because of guilt.
The Bible says "For if our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and knows all things." (1John 3:20)

JackBizzle:

Have you chosen the path of destruction over God's love?
Then you are doom!!!
You are condemned to eternal torment!

God will deal with you for rejecting his love!

God will deal will you for counting his sacrifice as useless!

This is the reason why God create hell; it is not for those who makes mistakes but for those who deliberately choose destruction.
Well you've made your choice and you have no reason to blame God, for God is justified.

Hiswordxray:


Yes that word "guilty "
What did you do that make you feel guilty?
No matter what it might be God will forgive you.
You can't run away from God because of guilt.
The Bible says "For if our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and knows all things." (1John 3:20)

i understand your authentic urge to evangelize, but lets stick to the concern of this thread or its fallout.

What is the purpose of human existence in Christianity other than going to Heaven?

Kay17:


i understand your authentic urge to evangelize, but lets stick to the concern of this thread or its fallout.

What is the purpose of human existence in Christianity other than going to Heaven?

The concern of this trend doesn't matter.
My urge to evangelize doesn't matter.
What matters is you!!!
You are suffering from guilt.
But why suffer when he died to set you free from guilty consciousness.

God said "Come now, and let us reason together,” Says the LORD, “Though your sins are like scarlet, They shall be as white as snow; Though they are red like crimson, They shall be as wool." (Isa 1:18).

JackBizzle:


Let's show the world how confused you are


Here is my statement in bold;
1) Life might have a purpose but it is clearly beyond us. If we knew the full account of our creation story, then we could say.


If a purpose for life is beyond us, how then is life not purposeless? Use your brain!!!

So anything beyond you is non-existent?

"Life is purposeless" and "life might have a purpose" are contradictory.

#ConfusedAtheist

JackBizzle:



You are confusing yourself.


The agnostic-atheist position is that there is no evidence for God and hence no reason to believe in God. The agnostic-atheist still holds a stance that there could be a God but until evidence comes for it, he will not believe in God.

After saying "there could be a God," can the Agnostic-Atheist also say "There cannot be a God" at the same time?

Can one say "the could be a purpose for life" and "there cannot be a purpose for life" at the same time?

#ConfusedAtheist

What is in your skull?

italo:


After saying "there could be a God," can the Agnostic-Atheist also say "There cannot be a God" at the same time?

Can one say "the could be a purpose for life" and "there cannot be a purpose for life" at the same time?

#ConfusedAtheist

What is in your skull?

Italo leave them. They refuse to admit that they are confuse and they need answers.

All atheist or agnostic are suffering from lack of Jesus.
They have this heartache they can't heal and they feel like like is purposeless and meaningless. This is just a reflection of their emptiness and desperation which only God could satisfy.

Hiswordxray:


Italo leave them. They refuse to admit that they are confuse and they need answers.

All atheist or agnostic are suffering from lack of Jesus.
They have this heartache they can't heal and they feel like like is purposeless and meaningless. This is just a reflection of their emptiness and desperation which only God could satisfy.

It is simply preposterous to make conclusions as this. Several humans have found fulfilment in varying endeavours. Religion fills that certain "vacuum" for some,it doesn't for others.

When we compare human lifetime with geologic time,we get to see how truly fleeting and brief our lives are. A geologist describes it this way:

Consider the distance between Los Angeles and NY,approximately 4500km i.e from the US West coast to East coast.If this 4500km represents the 4.5 billion year age of the earth, then the lifetime of a human being who lived for 100 years would be 0.1m i.e far less than the width of a sidewalk.

Again, if a motion picture moves at a rate of 32 frames per sec,and 1 frame represents 100 years,then a frame will only last on the screen for 1/32 sec. This means the lifetime of a human being who lived for 100 years will only occur as a flash on the screen.

A very humbling revelation indeed.

Beretta92:
Several humans have found fulfilment in varying endeavours. Religion fills that certain "vacuum" for some,it doesn't for others.

Is that what they told you or is that what you what to believe.

My dear friend, nothing could fill that vacuum except Christ.
Do not be deceived.

Hiswordxray:


The concern of this trend doesn't matter.
My urge to evangelize doesn't matter.
What matters is you!!!
You are suffering from guilt.
But why suffer when he died to set you free from guilty consciousness.

God said "Come now, and let us reason together,” Says the LORD, “Though your sins are like scarlet, They shall be as white as snow; Though they are red like crimson, They shall be as wool." (Isa 1:18).

Since what matters is me, then explain the purpose of humanity qua my purpose.

yes, I'd assume there is sin for the sake of convenience, but how relevant is the problem of sin to human existence?

Kay17:


Since what matters is me, then explain the purpose of humanity qua my purpose.

yes, I'd assume there is sin for the sake of convenience, but how relevant is the problem of sin to human existence?

The reason why you feel life has no purpose and is meaningless is because you are lacking Christ.
This is not a problem of humanity, this is a problem of you heart.

Again, is it sin that made you run away from God?
Are you finding it difficult to stop committing sin?

There is a way out.

Hiswordxray:


The reason why you feel life has no purpose and is meaningless is because you are lacking Christ.
This is not a problem of humanity, this is a problem of you heart.

Again, is it sin that made you run away from God?
Are you finding it difficult to stop committing sin?

There is a way out.

This man, do you have a problem with basic comprehension?! I didn't tell you my life was meaningless, rather I asked what is the purpose of a Christian's life

Kay17:


This man, do you have a problem with basic comprehension?! I didn't tell you my life was meaningless, rather I asked what is the purpose of a Christian's life

Oh sorry I misunderstood you.
The purpose of a Christian life is to participate in God eternal plan which he had from the foundation of the word.
A plan which was once hidden in a mystery but have now be reveal to us through the spirit (1Cor 2:6-12).

Hiswordxray:


Oh sorry I misunderstood you.
The purpose of a Christian life is to participate in God eternal plan which he had from the foundation of the word.
A plan which was once hidden in a mystery but have now be reveal to us through the spirit (1Cor 2:6-12).

What is it? ? ?

Kay17:


What is it? ? ?

God building a home.

Jesus finding a wife which is of his kind. A wife that is him in another form. A wife that will be his glory.

An everlasting romance.

An outlet of an all consuming love.

Emancipation of a frustrated passion.

To answer the call of a God who is hopelessly in love.
What purpose could be better than this?

Hiswordxray:


God building a home.

Jesus finding a wife which is of his kind. A wife that is him in another form. A wife that will be his glory.

An everlasting romance.

An outlet of an all consuming love.

Emancipation of a frustrated passion.

To answer the call of a God who is hopelessly in love.
What purpose could be better than this?

So the purpose of a Christian is to build house, find wife (in a woman's case, I'd assume husband), look for romance and emancipate a frustrated passion. But these items you mentioned have to be a means to some end, they have to be for happiness at least. They cannot be ends in themselves. Having a romance is not for the mere purpose of having a romance, people naturally expect happiness to result from such romance, don't they?

In a few words of protest, these do not seem like a purpose.

Kay17:


So the purpose of a Christian is to build house, find wife (in a woman's case, I'd assume husband), look for romance and emancipate a frustrated passion. But these items you mentioned have to be a means to some end, they have to be for happiness at least. They cannot be ends in themselves. Having a romance is not for the mere purpose of having a romance, people naturally expect happiness to result from such romance, don't they?

In a few words of protest, these do not seem like a purpose.

Yes you have found what you're looking for; another misunderstanding, another excuse to tell your desperate heart that Christ is not they way. But you no that a lie.
You know you didn't understand what I wrote.
But you are happy you've found another excuse.
How long would you continue like this?
How long would you continue to fight that voice in your heart?
How long would you continue to find excuses when you know it is not working. Your heart still continue to cry out for God.
Did you think you can find something else to fill that emptiness?

Well stop deceiving yourself.

Hiswordxray:


Have you chosen the path of destruction over God's love?
Then you are doom!!!
You are condemned to eternal torment!

God will deal with you for rejecting his love!

God will deal will you for counting his sacrifice as useless!

This is the reason why God create hell; it is not for those who makes mistakes but for those who deliberately choose destruction.
Well you've made your choice and you have no reason to blame God, for God is justified.

I.D.I.O.T.I.C post! Eternal torment? does that make sense to you?

Oduduwaboy:

I.D.I.O.T.I.C post! Eternal torment? does that make sense to you?

Are you scared of hell?
Does it pains you that you're going to miss heaven?

You don't need to be scared simply ask for the way.

Hiswordxray:


Is that what they told you or is that what you what to believe.

My dear friend, nothing could fill that vacuum except Christ.
Do not be deceived.

How parochial, those words.

Hiswordxray:

God building a home.
Jesus finding a wife which is of his kind. A wife that is him in another form. A wife that will be his glory.
An everlasting romance.
An outlet of an all consuming love.
Emancipation of a frustrated passion.
To answer the call of a God who is hopelessly in love.
What purpose could be better than this?

Kay17:

So the purpose of a Christian is to build house, find wife (in a woman's case, I'd assume husband), look for romance and emancipate a frustrated passion. But these items you mentioned have to be a means to some end, they have to be for happiness at least. They cannot be ends in themselves. Having a romance is not for the mere purpose of having a romance, people naturally expect happiness to result from such romance, don't they?
In a few words of protest, these do not seem like a purpose.

Hiswordxray:


Yes you have found what you're looking for; another misunderstanding, another excuse to tell your desperate heart that Christ is not they way. But you no that a lie.
You know you didn't understand what I wrote.
But you are happy you've found another excuse.
How long would you continue like this?
How long would you continue to fight that voice in your heart?
How long would you continue to find excuses when you know it is not working. Your heart still continue to cry out for God.
Did you think you can find something else to fill that emptiness?

Well stop deceiving yourself.

I will have to assume you concede to me about the nihilism of Christianity and its shallow meaning.

Next, I will address your 'psychoanalytical' exercise on me. It is virtually impossible for you to read my mind and extract the above information. The best you can do is try to generalize your condition. Meaning that you equate your emotions and condition for mine. The 'inner voice in your head' is assumed to be in everybody's head. And you assume your vulnerable nature is assumed to be the nature of everybody else. And that your only saviour -- Jesus is everybody's saviour.

The only person indulging in self deception is sadly you.

I'm happy that this thread has touched a lot of people

JackBizzle:
I'm happy that this thread has touched a lot of people

But has it touch you?

Wonderful thread...a lot of self refective thoughts were made...

JackBizzle:
I'm happy that this thread has touched a lot of people

Sir,I'm not an atheist....but your thread and logical arguments have got to be among the best I have seen since joining this forum.I've always heard that name LogicBoy03/JackBizzle on this forum,associated with intelligence.I can now see why. Im really impressed,sir.
Great Thread.
#Respect

sonOfLucifer:
Life is not meaningless. You're only looking at it from a human angle: a species that has cost this planet all sorts of damage.
Life presents opportunities and lessons that help develop our inner man. It is one of the reasons why in the darkest of plaves, in the prison cells, in grave times, hope still shines through.
To the foolish man who believes this life is all there is, life would be utterly meaningless. To the one who knows he trancends this world in the form of ideas and thoughts he propagates during his sojourn, life has purpose. And that purpose is to conquer, to surmount every fear, to learn, to explore, to embrace knowledge wherever it may be found. I have found a purpose in Lucifer. It is left to you to find yours.

Wow. I was rereading this thread and I just realised that I didn't see this comment when I was actively participating on this thread.


Nice trolling job.

sonOfLucifer:
Life is not meaningless. You're only looking at it from a human angle: a species that has cost this planet all sorts of damage.
Life presents opportunities and lessons that help develop our inner man. It is one of the reasons why in the darkest of plaves, in the prison cells, in grave times, hope still shines through.
To the foolish man who believes this life is all there is, life would be utterly meaningless. To the one who knows he trancends this world in the form of ideas and thoughts he propagates during his sojourn, life has purpose. And that purpose is to conquer, to surmount every fear, to learn, to explore, to embrace knowledge wherever it may be found. I have found a purpose in Lucifer. It is left to you to find yours.

*rolls eyes*
sKeeter you are so full of it!

UyiIredia:

And so. build universities, do charity, run successful businesses etc

Muslim Hindus Buddhist atheist etc do all the above

Firstly, OP, I honestly connect with all that you have said, I am a Christian(I believe in the death of Christ) and a Scientist(I observe, reason, ask questions about Nature, Appreciate Natural Logic........and science seem to explain Nature- the known nature), Rather than asking myself What's Life purpose is(cos I have no shadow of doubt about Life's Purpose and meaning) I ask why I was born into the christian religion cos it answers most of my inner-self questions (Purpose, meaning and others)

Truthfully looking from the perspectives you've laid down... I will say, YES, Life has no meaning, Is there meaning in the fact that the universe(multiverse or any other meaningful way we may name) has no edge(end) or rather that the edge keeps expanding(This means even science itself hasn't explained all), What is even a meaningfully meaningful meaning of meaning of Life(This means Plain Logic define Truth).

Looking at Solomon(the wisest man that ever lived according to the Bible, He also asked inner-self questions), He explored Nature(Gardens),Culture(With the Many Wives the married from different Places), Pleasure(Love, Sex) and different kinds of Religion(Not only Judaism, maybe at least 100 based on the number of Foreign wives he had). He also concluded that all is Vanity(Meaninglessness).

As Humans, I believe we have a soul which transcends Life, The soul feels real Joy, Peace and Happiness, Which we believe to be Part of Life's meaning. It is then with this notion that what gives meaning to Life must transcend Life. It is when this is understood that meaning starts to open up to one.

I believe in everlasting Life, which all Humans long for and I haven't seen any scientific explanation that says this is the way to have everlasting Life. Only Religion answers the Question, and I think its reasonable when one says we live to prepare for an afterlife(everlasting) and its depends on the way we live here that determines how our afterlife would be.

We all long for a World without conflict and absolute peace which means a would without conflict or quarrels, and a perfect form of government. The Bible says Sin brought about the fall of man(everyone knows we are better than this, we have our good part inside of us which means if everyone lives based only on the good inside, The world would be a peaceful Place). The Bible tells us that world is coming, the one we currently live in is Broken.

Salvation means we as broken beings sincerely realize it and ask God to save us from our brokenness and also make us fit for the Kingdom to come whilst forgiving us of the the ways we've used the Bad part of US. Christs blood has being shed for that Forgiveness. And his Nature itself is Life's Meaning.

PS.
The Bible when interpreted well has many illustrations of the Life of others and the mark they left........Its meaning....Sincerely, seek God from a contrite Heart and he would be found of you....And You'll then realize, God is Meaning...else Meaninglessness

I pray that God would open up your Heart to find Truth, cos even these Words I right can be proved Logically wrong.

Takia and God Bless

JackBizzle:
Death and Meaning

In the next 100 years, none of you reading this post will be alive.

Life is so fleeting when one considers how short it can be.

Also consider that our galaxy is over 10 billion years old. We never get to even live a quarter of that time frame.


What really is the point of life if it ends all in death?


One lives all his or her life struggling to survive ie struggling to avoid death which will inevitably occur.


A medical student who was the best in his class throughout university died on his first day as a doctor.


You can work hard all your life and die the moment you want to reap what you have sowed.

===================================================

An animal life

What is the purpose of a fish? To be eaten by sharks and human beings? Just to live and die as food for other animals?
What is the purpose of a cat? To beg for milk and fish from humans?

We can all agree that assigning a purpose to an animals life is ridiculous. Why then are humans exempt?

We think we are special because we can reason. A dog looking at the moon can not understand the significance of the lunar cycle. The same way we can never understand the universe in its entirety. So how are we really different?

Our reasoning has limits. What if the purpose of life is truly beyond our reasoning abilities? What if the minds of the gods were meant for more evolved beings?


========================================================================


Purpose and Religion

To the religious people claiming that our purpose as humans to serve and worship God, they should understand that it is not just true logically if you consider the death of babies.

Babies who die in the womb due to natural/spontaneous abortions never get to worship God or even develop the reasoning ability to understand any concept of God. Natural abortions are the most common abortions that occur in millions every year.

Those babies that die in the millions do not get to worship God in their brief life. So, I ask again; what is the purpose of life? What exactly is God's purpose for babies dying natural deaths in the womb?


What is even the essence of religion? The way religion was practised in the 7th century is different from the one practised today. It all seems arbitrary- religious doctrines sway to the interpretations of whichever religious leaders are in power or the most vocal.

Buddhism promises some inner peace, Islam promises a total way of life for peace, Christianity promises salvation, Paganism promises oneness with the earth. But all these do not guarantee a better life on earth. You could die the same day you convert to any of these religions. One can live a fulfilled life without any of these religions.


====================================================================

So what is your purpose in this life?


What exactly is your purpose?
1) To leave a legacy?
All legacies get bastardized after a while. Jesus Christ is now popularly known as a white Italian hippie. Whereas, in reality Jesus would have been a dark skinned radical Jew.

Worse, only few people get to leave legacies. If you dont have money or power, you will die a nobody. Afterall, even the few people that will remember you will die eventually.

2) To enjoy life to the fullest?
Hedonists usually die quicker. What if you were born without legs or as a Siamese twin? What then? You wouldnt be able to enjoy most sports. Most people will treat you as a freak. Se.x or marriage partners would be harder to come by. And so on.


3) Religious devotion (to the afterlife)
Yes, the afterlife. A life after death that you have never seen and cannot prove. A haven that you have been promised by religion but with crazy standards to fulfil.
If preparing for heaven is the purpose of life then, life is truly pointless. Why not just send us to heaven directly? Why would we need to be tried and tested if God knows our inclinations? What is the point in putting us in such a world where the only the fittest survive? This life is such an unnecessary test if one adheres to an all-knowing God. We are nothing but pawns in an eternal chess game.


4) I was born to be a leader/accountant/doctor
Hitler could also claim that he was born to lead the Aryan race and exterminate "rats" like the Jews. No one is born to be anything. We can only prepare ourselves and our talents for a brighter future.
Wayne Rooney was also a talented boxer. Man chooses his destiny (at the discretion of fate).

===================================================

What do I believe as the purpose of meaning of life?

Life has no meaning. We only ascribe meaning to it because it is our human nature to see patterns even where there are no patterns.

The best we can do is give our lives meanings ourselves through the one factor that distinguishes us from animals- reasoning.

As arbitrary as that sounds, reason and logic are the only effective tools for understanding our universe and navigating it. A well reasoned life is a better life.