Jeromejnr:


Hehe. Only God know what you wrote up there.

Now read this article I saw online and stop being ignorant:

Catholics argue that praying to Mary and the saints is no different than asking someone here on earth to pray for us. Let us examine that claim. (1) The Apostle Paul asks other Christians to pray for him in Ephesians 6:19. Many Scriptures describe believers praying for one another (2 Corinthians 1:11; Ephesians 1:16; Philippians 1:19; 2 Timothy 1:3). The Bible nowhere mentions anyone asking for someone in heaven to pray for him. The Bible nowhere describes anyone in heaven praying for anyone on earth. (2) The Bible gives absolutely no indication that Mary or the saints can hear our prayers. Mary and the saints are not omniscient. Even glorified in heaven, they are still finite beings with limitations. How could they possibly hear the prayers of millions of people? Whenever the Bible mentions praying to or speaking with the dead, it is in the context of sorcery, witchcraft, necromancy, and divination—activities the Bible strongly condemns (Leviticus 20:27; Deuteronomy 18:10-13). In the one instance when a "saint" is spoken to, Samuel in 1 Samuel 28:7-19, Samuel is not exactly happy to be disturbed. It is clear that praying to Mary or the saints is completely different from asking someone here on earth to pray for us. One has a strong biblical basis; the other has no biblical basis whatsoever.

God does not answer prayers based on who is praying. God answers prayers based on whether they are asked according to His will (1 John 5:14-15). There is absolutely no basis or need to pray to anyone other than God alone. There is no basis for asking those who are in heaven to pray for us. Only God can hear our prayers. Only God can answer our prayers. No one in heaven has any greater access to God's throne than we do through prayer (Hebrews 4:16).

Jesus was seen speaking with Moses and Elijah, he must have been a sorcerer. EIya

dmandy:


The church as whole decided you can pray to Mary! Its ur choice not to pray to her, so you can ad well choose to celebrate Christmas on 29th Feb.

FYI Mary does not take the place of Jesus as a mediator.... he prays for me to God through Jesus the same way my Pastor does. If you don't understand her role ask the Apostles at the wedding which took place at Cana.

Hehe. always doing a good job of shooting yourself in the foot.

Lets go back to scripture shall we:

If you say so (for reasons unexplainable to mankind) that the Cana event meant praying to Mary then we can also say why don't you pray to demons to help you talk to God. Why?

Matt 8:31 :So the demons began to plead with Jesus, saying, "If you drive us out, send us into that herd of pigs."

"The demons began to entreat Him, saying, "If You are going to cast us out, send us into the herd of swine."

And Jesus answered their prayers:

"and He said to them, "Go!" And they came out and went into the swine, and the whole herd rushed down the steep bank into the sea and perished in the waters.…"

Check you dictionary the word Pray means to entreat, plead, beg e.t.c

So you also since Jesus answered the demons prayer, pray to demons to help you talk to God. (I mean those pigs were someone's business, why will Jesus answer them and allow the demons do something like that).

BTW, I love the way you are stretching my scriptural knowledge.

dmandy:


Check the book of Jerome

Out of words I see.

dmandy:


Jesus was seen speaking with Moses and Elijah, he must have been a sorcerer. EIya

Pointless.

BTW, still waiting for scriptures.

Jeromejnr:


Pointless.

BTW, still waiting for scriptures.

According to you anybody speaking with the dead is a sorcerer.... your words.

Jeromejnr:


Whenever the Bible mentions praying to or speaking with the dead, it is in the context of sorcery, witchcraft, necromancy, and divination—activities the Bible strongly condemns (Leviticus 20:27; Deuteronomy 18:10-13). In the one instance when a "saint" is spoken to, Samuel in 1 Samuel 28:7-19, Samuel is not exactly happy to be disturbed.

And Moses the servant of the LORD died there in Moab, as the LORD had said. Deut. 34:5

italo:


Nowhere. Wait for Jesus to come down and tell you that Saints in heaven who talk, think, have feelings and know about happenings on earth...are also aware of prayers on earth.

So you have no prove in the Scriptures of Mary hearing your prayer? Supposing it is the queen of heaven answering your prayers, at least that's in the Bible (Jeremiah 7:18; 44:17-25).

Jeromejnr:


Hehe. always doing a good job of shooting yourself in the foot.

Lets go back to scripture shall we:

If you say so (for reasons unexplainable to mankind) that the Cana event meant praying to Mary then we can also say why don't you pray to demons to help you talk to God. Why?

Matt 8:31 :So the demons began to plead with Jesus, saying, "If you drive us out, send us into that herd of pigs."

"The demons began to entreat Him, saying, "If You are going to cast us out, send us into the herd of swine."

And Jesus answered their prayers:

"and He said to them, "Go!" And they came out and went into the swine, and the whole herd rushed down the steep bank into the sea and perished in the waters.…"

Check you dictionary the word Pray means to entreat, plead, beg e.t.c

So you also since Jesus answered the demons prayer, pray to demons to help you talk to God. (I mean those pigs were someone's business, why will Jesus answer them and allow the demons do something like that).

BTW, I love the way you are stretching my scriptural knowledge.

I really shot myself in the foot and it hurts so badly.

Forgive me demons can pray but saints can't. Eiya!!! It really hurts.

Like I said I do this for my fellow Catholics and Catholic wanna be's whom you people easily deceive with vague quotations read out of context. Never think I am wasting my time. Now Demons can pray

Jeromejnr:
{So you also since Jesus answered the demons prayer, pray to demons to help you talk to God.}

but Saints cannot. You see your life?

dmandy:


According to you anybody speaking with the dead is a sorcerer.... your words.

And Moses the servant of the LORD died there in Moab, as the LORD had said. Deut. 34:5

Okay, since you decided to run away form the other argument and change topic. As usual I give you scriptures.

1. First of all I any said anything about anyone being a sorcerer. (always putting words in my mouth as usual.)

2. How is Moses and Elijah dead when even Jesus Himself correcting His followers said:

Matt 22:32 "But Jesus answered and said to them, "You are mistaken, not understanding the Scriptures nor the power of God........"But regarding the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was spoken to you by God: 'I AM THE GOD OF ABRAHAM, AND THE GOD OF ISAAC, AND THE GOD OF JACOB '? He is not the God of the dead but of the living." When the crowds heard this, they were astonished at His teaching."

Those are Words from the Master Himself, If you like contradict it.

BTW that scripture also goes for those that believe in soul sleep.

dmandy:


I really shot myself in the foot and it hurts so badly.

Forgive me demons can pray but saints can't. Eiya!!! It really hurts.

Like I said I do this for my fellow Catholics and Catholic wanna be's whom you people easily deceive with vague quotations read out of context. Never think I am wasting my time. Now Demons can pray but Saints cannot. You see your life?

Hehe. See confusion.

Are you not the one that said you could pray to saints? Yes! since you said so I wanted to also tell you to pray to demons na. SMH.

The issue is, where is scripture on praying to saints in heaven?

Jeromejnr:


Hehe. See confusion.

Are you not the one that said you could pray to saints? Yes! since you said so I wanted to also tell you to pray to demons na. SMH.

The issue is, where is scripture on praying to saints in heaven?

Waoh.. you are really good at this job.... you agree pray means beg when it suits your claim. You said saints can't pray but demons can. Who exactly is confused here? You can't deceive me... get that.

dmandy:


Waoh.. you are really good at this job.... you agree pray means beg when it suits your claim. You said saints can't pray but demons can. Who exactly is confused here? You can't deceive me... get that.

Guy abeg which skul u go? Maybe we should start from there.

My guy,the issue with you is that you've been brainwashed conditioned a certain way. So it's hard for you, even when you can see the truth, to accept it.

Jeromejnr:


Guy abeg which skul u go? Maybe we should start from there.

My guy,the issue with you is that you've been brainwashed conditioned a certain way. So it's hard for you, even when you can see the truth, to accept it.

Well I think your own brain needs a little washing....

Now look at Lot committing sorcery (praying to angels), Gen 19:1 The two angels arrived at Sodom in the evening, and Lot was sitting in the gateway of the city. When he saw them, he got up to meet them and bowed down with his face to the ground. 2"My lords," he said, "please [/b]turn aside to your servant's house. You can wash your feet and spend the night and then go on your way early in the morning." "No," they answered, "we will spend the night in the square."

Now angels committing sacrilege (praying to lot)...v:15 the angels [b]urged Lot, Hurry! take your wife......

Mr. Jerome, your brain needs a little washing by God to start seeing good things in others and stop hating. Heaven is big for all of us... we are not in competition.

Jeromejnr:


Guy abeg which skul u go? Maybe we should start from there.

My guy,the issue with you is that you've been brainwashed conditioned a certain way. So it's hard for you, even when you can see the truth, to accept it.

A school that teaches how people not to read words in isolation.

And your truth is ... history and tradition is important only when it supports your claim and no other. That everything in bible concerns you except 'behold your mother'

Your truth is anybody speaking to the dead is a sorcerer... but Jesus did.

Your truth is that nobody can lead anybody to Jesus.

Your truth Saints dont become saints when they die, they only add up to the saints....hahahahahahahahahah

dmandy:


Well I think your own brain needs a little washing....

Now look at Lot committing sorcery (praying to angels), Gen 19:1 The two angels arrived at Sodom in the evening, and Lot was sitting in the gateway of the city. When he saw them, he got up to meet them and bowed down with his face to the ground. 2"My lords," he said, "please [/b]turn aside to your servant's house. You can wash your feet and spend the night and then go on your way early in the morning." "No," they answered, "we will spend the night in the square."

Now angels committing sacrilege (praying to lot)...v:15 the angels [b]urged Lot, Hurry! take your wife......

Mr. Jerome, your brain needs a little washing by God to start seeing good things in others and stop hating. Heaven is big for all of us... we are not in competition.

Lord have Mercy

Abeg, my guy just give up. Even folks of your own fold would be ashamed seeing what you just wrote.

Chai! I have see tins on Nairaland.

I don't even need to answer you on this issue. Go take your bible and study. I have even giving you scriptures before that will help you with this your silly question.

dmandy:


A school that teaches how people not to read words in isolation.

And your truth is ... history and tradition is important only when it supports your claim and no other. That everything in bible concerns you except 'behold your mother'

No be only behold your mother. Why don't you enlighten us on how behold you mother was talking to all the church.

Jeromejnr:


Lord have Mercy

Abeg, my guy just give up. Even folks of your own fold would be ashamed seeing what you just wrote.

Chai! I have see tins on Nairaland.

I don't even need to answer you on this issue. Go take your bible and study. I have even giving you scriptures before that will help you with this your silly question.

But you said anybody praying to saints, angels commit sacrilege... I am only telling you my fellow sacrilegious beings.

dmandy:


But you said anybody praying to saints, angels commit sacrilege... I am only telling you my fellow sacrilegious beings.

Okay, so your point is you can also pray to angels abi?

Jeromejnr:




No be only behold your mother. Why don't you enlighten us on how behold you mother was talking to all the church.

It's not your business naa... na only 'John'

But if Paul tells Timothy to study... you say Paul says that the whole church should study. You see your life?

The passage:

When Jesus then saw His mother, and the disciple whom He loved standing nearby, He said to His mother, "Woman, behold, your son!" 27Then He said to the disciple, "Behold, your mother!" From that hour the disciple took her into his own household.

dmandy:


It's not your business naa... na only 'John'

But if Paul tells Timothy to study... you say Paul says that the whole church should study. You see your life?

Lol!

So Since Paul told the Roman church to greet Priscilla and Aquila, why don't you also go to their house right now and greet them?

Rom 16:3 "Greet Prisca and Aquila, my fellow workers in Christ Jesus,".

SMH.

Jeromejnr:


Okay, so your point is you can also pray to angels abi?

Exactly my point.. God bless you.

Jeromejnr:


Lol!

So Since Paul told the Roman church to greet Priscilla and Aquila, why don't you also go to their house right now and greet them?

Rom 16:3 "Greet Prisca and Aquila, my fellow workers in Christ Jesus,".

SMH.

Well I will greet them hear and now. Good evening Priscilla, good evening Aquila. How are you today? St. Paul asked me to greet you.

How about that?

Guess I have sinned (against you) for greeting them.

dmandy:


Exactly my point.. God bless you.

Wow.

Verily, Verily I say unto you, you need to be born again sir.

dmandy:


Well I will greet them hear and now. Good evening Priscilla, good evening Aquila. How are you today? St. Paul asked me to greet you.

How about that?

Guess I have sinned (against you) for greeting them.

.How old are you sef?

maybe i have been discussing with a small child all this while.

Jeromejnr:


.How old are you sef?

maybe i have been discussing with a small child all this while.

Old enough to notice a hypocrite.

Jeromejnr:


Wow.

Verily, Verily I say unto you, you need to be born again sir.

Verily, verily I say unto you, you need to start working out your salvation in fear and trembling and stop assuming that heaven is for you alone.

dmandy:


Old enough to notice a hypocrite.

Hypocrite of what?

sharing the truth?

Jeromejnr:


Hypocrite of what?

sharing the truth?

Of taking only what you prefer as truth and every other thing lies.


Listen to urself in another thread...

Jeromejnr:
We all know there will be a white throne judgement. But base your findings on scriptures. What about this?

"But ye are come unto ... the heavenly Jerusalem ... to the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the SPIRITS of just men made perfect." (Hebrews 12:23-24) This clearly tells us that when believers die, their spirits go to heaven immediately.

1 Thessalonians 4:14 tells us that the spirits of believers who have died, are waiting in heaven until the day when Jesus Christ will bring their spirits and souls with Him at the second coming in the air to be rejoined with their resurrected bodies. "... them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with Him." Their dead bodies, buried in the grave will be resurrected to rejoin their spirits and souls which Christ will bring with Him from heaven. Christ bringing their spirits and souls, shows that they are with Christ in heaven after death awaiting the resurrection.

After the rapture (catching away of believers to heaven) many people get saved in the seven year tribulation. Many of these are killed by the Antichrist. Do their souls go to soul-sleep in the grave? No! Their souls are seen under the altar in heaven: "I saw under the altar the SOULS of them that were slain for the word of God ... they cried with a loud voice, saying ..." (Revelation 6:9-10)

These souls of dead believers are in heaven. They can cry out with a loud voice. They have memory of their death on earth, crying for revenge. They are not unconscious or soul-sleeping in the grave.

Yesterday dead souls cry for revenge... today dead souls know nothing happening on earth.

Deceive those who let you Sir.... But you are truely good at what you do anyways

And if one member suffers, all the members suffer with it; if one member is honored, all the members rejoice with it. 27Now you are Christ's body, and individually members of it.

Sir, you need to know those lines....

dmandy:


Of taking only what you prefer as truth and every other thing lies.


Listen to urself in another thread...



Yesterday dead souls cry for revenge... today dead souls know nothing happening on earth.

Deceive those who let you Sir.... But you are truely good at what you do anyways

I love the way you had to go source for things I said in other posts . (I too like you my guy).

BTW, it's totally obvious you don't even understand what we were discussing there and the point we were trying to make.

You've not finished understanding the praying to Mary dogma is it now that that one which is much deeper you will understand?

1. There is no such thing as a dead soul like you said.

2. Lets not change topic. Lets first kill one bird. You don't have to run away from the bird.

3. Yes souls were crying for revenge because it was the tribulation and everyone in heaven was involved in all that was happening. As saints were preparing to come back on horses with Christ and rule in the Millennium.

Jeromejnr:


I love the way you had to go source for things I said in other posts . (I too like you my guy).

BTW, it's totally obvious you don't even understand what we were discussing there and the point we were trying to make.

You've not finished understanding the praying to Mary dogma is it now that that one which is much deeper you will understand?

1. There is no such thing as a dead soul like you said.

2. Lets not change topic. Lets first kill one bird. You don't have to run away from the bird.

3. Yes souls were crying for revenge because it was the tribulation and everyone in heaven was involved in all that was happening. As saints were preparing to come back on horses with Christ and rule in the Millennium.

sorry sir,

In that thread souls in heaven can avenge death, but in this one they know nothing about death. Just to show u what you have been doing since we started discussing. Things are true the very moment they support ur claim and false any other time.

okay have they stopped crying? If so how did they know that their demands have been made since they do not know what goes on earth. If they are still crying, are they supposed to do so forever?

You too much, Bro J.

dmandy:


sorry sir,

In that thread souls in heaven can avenge death, but in this one they know nothing about death. Just to show u what you have been doing since we started discussing. Things are true the very moment they support ur claim and false any other time.

You too much.

Please show me where it says or I said they can avenge enemies? When after all God told them to rest a while.

Show me where it said you prayed to those souls to help you avenge enemies on the earth?

Show me where it says souls in heaven can feel emotional pain? (Because from what we got from that scripture those souls were just beheaded for the word and just got to the presence of God, so robes where given to them. Or were they naked all this while in heaven?)

Please if souls in heaven are not supposed to feel any sort of emotional pain, how is God going to allow Mary to recieve millions requests of hurtful humans of all kinds (Murder, sickness e.t.c.) when she is supposed to be having joy and pleasures over there?

If you want me to go logical with you I will.

dmandy:


Of taking only what you prefer as truth and every other thing lies.


Listen to urself in another thread...



Yesterday dead souls cry for revenge... today dead souls know nothing happening on earth.

Deceive those who let you Sir.... But you are truely good at what you do anyways

And if one member suffers, all the members suffer with it; if one member is honored, all the members rejoice with it. 27Now you are Christ's body, and individually members of it.

Sir, you need to know those lines....

That is how you people go about deceiving those who do not know their scriptures and they quickly drop their faith and start to limit themselves where there is no need.

Its not by force if you don't want to help others in prayer or seek the help of others, no problem. Stopping telling people who do that they have sinned. Its a lie, God did not say so... say only what God said.

Jeromejnr:



Please show me where it says or I said they can avenge enemies? When after all God told them to rest a while.

Show me where it said you prayed to those souls to help you avenge enemies on the earth?

Show me where it says souls in heaven can feel emotional pain? (Because from what we got from that scripture those souls were just beheaded for the word and just got to the presence of God, so robes where given to them. Or were they naked all this while in heaven?)

Please if souls in heaven are not supposed to feel any sort of emotional pain, how is God going to allow Mary to recieve millions requests of hurtful humans of all kinds (Murder, sickness e.t.c.) when she is supposed to be having joy and pleasures over there?

If you want me to go logical with you I will.

You are the one who said on this thread that souls in heaven are not supposed to know the pains in the world. Did God say that?. Now you have turned to say that they are supposed to feel emotional pain because now it suits your claim but where it doesn't its a lie. They don't feel anything. Nnaaa nawa for you o..... na this kind thing you de do ur followers? There is God oooo