Ubenedictus: really?? How does the trinity confuse you??

Ubenedictus: take note, God isn't exactly a person. GOD IS A NATURE, that is why d greek word for God isn't exactly personal, theo, can mean "diety". Thus i can say one essence in 3 persons. D above misunderstanding goes away if essence is differentiated form person. i think some organism on earth reproduce like that. I doesn't suprise me amen, through faith.

striktlymi: Good morning Uben,



Doesn't it confuse you? Wow!!! You would be the first I have come in contact with. When I try to apply reason and logic to the trinity from what we can observe, I come out empty. The ish would be to understand why Jesus would relate to the Father in prayer where in fact he is relating with himself. Or a situation where Jesus promises the comforter (the Holy spirit) when he has the same essence as the spirit. Why must Christ go away before the spirit come if they are indeed one and the same person?

I do believe in the trinity but we really would have a hard time cracking the mystery surrounding the trinity. I do understand that God is unfathomable. He is great beyond comparison! He can do whatever he wants, be wherever he wants, decide to be in more than 3 places at the same time and reveal himself in more than one way but the ish is still WHY??

Why would it (God transcends any s*x) decide to reveal itself in this way? Is it trying to relate it's various natures to mankind? Is it saying that the Father is the all powerful ruler and creator, the God of Justice and fairness who is at the core of the Universe' 'delicate' balance? The Son brings forth his compassion and care for all his creation, it's redemptive nature and it's longing to relate with it's creation in a more personal level in order to guide us to itself? While the spirit brings forth it's nature as teacher, the means where men get consoled and lead in gentle companionship through all ages to the Father?

Mehn, this is harder than it looks!



if God is not exactly a person but a nature, why then do we describe the trinity as "three persons in one"?


Thanks man!

striktlymi: Good morning Uben,



Doesn't it confuse you? Wow!!! You would be the first I have come in contact with. When I try to apply reason and logic to the trinity from what we can observe, I come out empty. The ish would be to understand why Jesus would relate to the Father in prayer where in fact he is relating with himself. Or a situation where Jesus promises the comforter (the Holy spirit) when he has the same essence as the spirit. Why must Christ go away before the spirit come if they are indeed one and the same person?

I do believe in the trinity but we really would have a hard time cracking the mystery surrounding the trinity. I do understand that God is unfathomable. He is great beyond comparison! He can do whatever he wants, be wherever he wants, decide to be in more than 3 places at the same time and reveal himself in more than one way but the ish is still WHY??

Why would it (God transcends any s*x) decide to reveal itself in this way? Is it trying to relate it's various natures to mankind? Is it saying that the Father is the all powerful ruler and creator, the God of Justice and fairness who is at the core of the Universe' 'delicate' balance? The Son brings forth his compassion and care for all his creation, it's redemptive nature and it's longing to relate with it's creation in a more personal level in order to guide us to itself? While the spirit brings forth it's nature as teacher, the means where men get consoled and lead in gentle companionship through all ages to the Father?

Mehn, this is harder than it looks!



If God is not exactly a person but a nature, why then do we describe the trinity as "three persons in one"?


Thanks man!

Lovethywilbedon: LOGIC and REASON can only take the human person so far. when the evidence ends, LOVE OF TRUTH AND FAITH continues. *Strictlymi* what other explanation do you need? considering the fact that you are a catholic who belives in the MOST HOLY TRINITY. I can see you take fun in repeating the mistake of the Great Theologian "Saint Augustine of Hippo". know this brother, there are things that ara ABOVE and BEYOND human LOGIC and REASON, but that nevertheless, could be belived BECAUSE it is a "REVEALED TRUTH": The TRINITY is this kind of true teaching that comes down to us through GOD'S REVELATION and not our finding it out.

frosbel: The Trinity is a derived doctrine which only came into existent a few hundred years after Jesus and most of the Apostles had died.

I am sure that if this was a KEY doctrine , there would have been no need to derive it by human reasoning and logic, rather it would have been clearly stated in scripture.

That a Pagan Emperor endorsed this doctrine is suspect enough not to talk of the malice, acrimony , hatred and bloodbaths , that emanated from the forceful stamping of this unlawful doctrine into LAW.

Enough said !!!

frosbel: The Trinity is a derived doctrine which only came into existent a few hundred years after Jesus and most of the Apostles had died.

I am sure that if this was a KEY doctrine , there would have been no need to derive it by human reasoning and logic, rather it would have been clearly stated in scripture.

That a Pagan Emperor endorsed this doctrine is suspect enough not to talk of the malice, acrimony , hatred and bloodbaths , that emanated from the forceful stamping of this unlawful doctrine into LAW.

Enough said !!!

striktlymi:

Top of the day to you Love,

I couldn't hide a smile after reading your post...first of, it's been long I saw you around these 'paths'; hope all is well with you?

You need not worry about the 'error' of St. Augustine cause like him, I believe firmly in whatever the Church defines as dogma without doubt just as it was in the time of the apostles.

I know it would be easier to empty the ocean into a cup than to use my frail human faculty to understand the mysteries surrounding the triune God. But c'mon Love, there is no harm in having a chit-chat about some article of our faith in order to appreciate the teaching authority of the Church.

#This is just the first of a series of questions I have

striktlymi: Good morning Uben,
Doesn't it confuse you? Wow!!! You would be the first I have come in contact with. When I try to apply reason and logic to the trinity from what we can observe, I come out empty. The ish would be to understand why Jesus would relate to the Father in prayer where in fact he is relating with himself.

Or a situation where Jesus promises the comforter (the Holy spirit) when he has the same essence as the spirit.

Why must Christ go away before the spirit come if they are indeed one and the same person?

I do believe in the trinity but we really would have a hard time cracking the mystery surrounding the trinity. I do understand that God is unfathomable. He is great beyond comparison! He can do whatever he wants, be wherever he wants, decide to be in more than 3 places at the same time and reveal himself in more than one way but the ish is still WHY??

Why would it (God transcends any s*x) decide to reveal itself in this way? Is it trying to relate it's various natures to mankind? Is it saying that the Father is the all powerful ruler and creator, the God of Justice and fairness who is at the core of the Universe' 'delicate' balance? The Son brings forth his compassion and care for all his creation, it's redemptive nature and it's longing to relate with it's creation in a more personal level in order to guide us to itself? While the spirit brings forth it's nature as teacher, the means where men get consoled and lead in gentle companionship through all ages to the Father?

Mehn, this is harder than it looks!
If God is not exactly a person but a nature, why then do we describe the trinity as "three persons in one"?
Thanks man!

Lovethywilbedon: LOGIC and REASON can only take the human person so far. when the evidence ends, LOVE OF TRUTH AND FAITH continues. *Strictlymi* what other explanation do you need? considering the fact that you are a catholic who belives in the MOST HOLY TRINITY. I can see you take fun in repeating the mistake of the Great Theologian "Saint Augustine of Hippo". know this brother, there are things that ara ABOVE and BEYOND human LOGIC and REASON, but that nevertheless, could be belived BECAUSE it is a "REVEALED TRUTH": The TRINITY is this kind of true teaching that comes down to us through GOD'S REVELATION and not our finding it out.

striktlymi:

Top of the day to you Love,

I couldn't hide a smile after reading your post...first of, it's been long I saw you around these 'paths'; hope all is well with you?

You need not worry about the 'error' of St. Augustine cause like him, I believe firmly in whatever the Church defines as dogma without doubt just as it was in the time of the apostles.

I know it would be easier to empty the ocean into a cup than to use my frail human faculty to understand the mysteries surrounding the triune God. But c'mon Love, there is no harm in having a chit-chat about some article of our faith in order to appreciate the teaching authority of the Church.

#This is just the first of a series of questions I have

Ubenedictus: Good evening dear, i also notice some misunderstanding in your idea of the trinity.
the above is an officially condemned heresy, let me explain.
When Jesus prays, he isn't praying to himself, he is praying to his father. The father is numerically distinct from the son and d son is distinct from the fada and the spirit. Simply put, d fada is not the son, the son is not the fada, the son is not the holyspirit and d holyspirit is not the father.
Jesus was praying to his father, not to himself. yeah each person has his work in our salvation. they are not one and the same person they are of one essence/substance.

Ubenedictus: these are quite beautiful, but note creation is not for the father alone, nor compasion for the son alone.
we describe the trinity as one essence and 3 persons. I told you earlier to differentiate substance/essence from person.

striktlymi: Good evening Ube,
Now I am struggling to catch up! This doesn't happen to me very often! Now let's go back to the basics again please. God the Father is distinct from God the son and God the Holy spirit though they have the same essence, hence the notion of a 'three in one God'.

The Son prays to the Father who is distinct and he also promised the paraclete who also is distinct from the Son and the Father. These distinct persons can relate with each other without necessarily relating to themselves in the process, yet they are one. And you don't find this kinda 'foncusing'?

When you say creation isn't for the Father alone and compassion not just for the son, are you implying that when the Son carry out an activity, the Spirit and the Father take part in that same activity and vise versa? If this is so, can it be said that the Father cannot act without involving the Son and the Spirit? Or the Spirit cannot act without involving the Son and the Father?

Ubenedictus: hope the bolded isn't sacasm? I don't alway appreciate it.
For the above it depends on what you understand by "the father is the God of Jesus", and what you understand by "equality".

Ubenedictus: the trinity doesnt have "two parts of a story to confuse us" truthfully, the knowledge of the trinity isn't different from the above questions.

Lovethywilbedon: LOGIC and REASON can only take the human person so far. when the evidence ends, LOVE OF TRUTH AND FAITH continues. *Strictlymi* what other explanation do you need? considering the fact that you are a catholic who belives in the MOST HOLY TRINITY. I can see you take fun in repeating the mistake of the Great Theologian "Saint Augustine of Hippo". know this brother, there are things that ara ABOVE and BEYOND human LOGIC and REASON, but that nevertheless, could be belived BECAUSE it is a "REVEALED TRUTH": The TRINITY is this kind of true teaching that comes down to us through GOD'S REVELATION and not our finding it out.

Ubenedictus: sis you're the best! Our knowledge is defective.
I just feel like screaming "allelujah"

Boomark:
Amen

Is Lov... a sis?

Boomark:

Please what is the REVEALED TRUTH about trinity. Did the revelation say it is still a mystery or do we now know the real truth?

Boomark:

Please tell us what it means when it is written "the Father is the God of Jesus." and when Jesus calls the Father "my God."

Ubenedictus: while on earth Jesus took our human nature! By that nature he took he was even less than the angels (heb 2:9). He was a creature like us all, with flesh and blood like us. The guy who created everything is now d thing he created. By his humanity He is thus under his fathers dominion just like i am. He can thus address the father as "my God" becos by his human nature dat is very true.
This is just one aspect.

ijawkid:



what about revelation 1:5-6 where Jesus still calls the almighty "MY GOD" in heaven.....??...



ABI u forget?...



your explanation up there is never supported by the scriptures...only pagan traditions can explain it....

Ubenedictus: Dear bookmark, i refuse to quote most of your comment becos i find some parts of it derogatory.


I'll ask you a question. Simple and direct,
DO YOU BELIEVE IT IS POSSIBLE FOR JESUS TO BE TRUELY GOD AND YET BE "LESS" THAN THE FATHER?
Thank you

Ubenedictus: i don't know, i usually skip d gender when i read.
Sorry if i made a mistake

Ubenedictus: it is revealed! We now know the truth! But revelation doesn't mean we can fathom it. GOD EXIST OF HIMSELF, it is a revealed truth, but i can't really fathon how from all eternity God just exist of himself!

Ubenedictus: while on earth Jesus took our human nature! By that nature he took he was even less than the angels (heb 2:9). He was a creature like us all, with flesh and blood like us. The guy who created everything is now d thing he created. By his humanity He is thus under his fathers dominion just like i am. He can thus address the father as "my God" becos by his human nature dat is very true.
This is just one aspect.

Ubenedictus: do not bring your derogatory remarks here pls. point of correction verses 5 and 6 weren't Jesus words but johns so d bolded isn't exactly correct.
do well to read up on the hypostatic union that should answer your question. and as i said earlier this is just one aspect.

Ubenedictus: do not bring your derogatory remarks here pls. point of correction verses 5 and 6 weren't Jesus words but johns so d bolded isn't exactly correct.
do well to read up on the hypostatic union that should answer your question. and as i said earlier this is just one aspect.

Boomark:

We are agreed to do it the catholic way. How do i sound derogatory? Shouldn't i ask simple question in our church when am confused like Mr Str?

Yes.

There are Gods (all of them are not equal), but there is one God over all of them, the Father.
There are lords(all of them are not equal), but there is one Lord over all of them, Christ.

Boomark:

Our God's existence as far as we know has no contradictory part. Even though we don't know it all.

It is not the same with trinity. That is why sir Str and so many are confused with even the little they know.

Boomark:

So he called the Father "my God"?